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Roger
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      03-07-2005, 01:40 PM
I really need your help.

First off, I have researched this on this and other news groups and a
side by side comparison in the store. Many of the archived discussion
posts were initial impressions, but now both cameras have been on the
market for ample time for some hard opinions to surface. My local
store is selling the D100 with a $200 Nikon rebate for $1300 after the
rebate. I likely can do better, but they've been kind enough to let me
bring my lenses and shoot a bunch of in-store photos on the two
cameras. I prefer the viewfinder of the D100, however.....

I'm interested in the users who have experience with these cameras and
there side by side usage or praises / discontents with the two
cameras. I'm finally about to buy one of these but they are complex
pieces of gear and while the D70 has some really nice additions, I'm
also interested in some hard usage info.

In what categories does the D100 have an edge? It's still commanding a
higher price and I think the technology and ergonomic edges belong to
the D70 (excluding the viewfinder). So what am I missing...

Best Regards,
Roger
 
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Rainy
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      03-07-2005, 02:58 PM
Try going here for some help. http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/d70.htm


Rainy Iannucci


"Roger" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> I really need your help.
>
> First off, I have researched this on this and other news groups and a
> side by side comparison in the store. Many of the archived discussion
> posts were initial impressions, but now both cameras have been on the
> market for ample time for some hard opinions to surface. My local
> store is selling the D100 with a $200 Nikon rebate for $1300 after the
> rebate. I likely can do better, but they've been kind enough to let me
> bring my lenses and shoot a bunch of in-store photos on the two
> cameras. I prefer the viewfinder of the D100, however.....
>
> I'm interested in the users who have experience with these cameras and
> there side by side usage or praises / discontents with the two
> cameras. I'm finally about to buy one of these but they are complex
> pieces of gear and while the D70 has some really nice additions, I'm
> also interested in some hard usage info.
>
> In what categories does the D100 have an edge? It's still commanding a
> higher price and I think the technology and ergonomic edges belong to
> the D70 (excluding the viewfinder). So what am I missing...
>
> Best Regards,
> Roger



 
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Owamanga
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      03-07-2005, 03:00 PM
On Mon, 07 Mar 2005 07:40:29 -0600, Roger <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>In what categories does the D100 have an edge? It's still commanding a
>higher price and I think the technology and ergonomic edges belong to
>the D70 (excluding the viewfinder). So what am I missing...


You are missing nothing, the vast majority choose the D70 because it's
a technically superior camera at a lower price.

I'm surprised you give ergonomic advantage to the D70, the D100 feels
better to me.

In addition to a better viewfinder, the D100 has MLU, some audio
recording gadget, and a more pro-body finish - bigger grips and extra
trigger button, cable release etc. It also takes less strikes to kill
a man with a D100 than a D70 would.

(Disclaimer: I haven't used the D100 for any significant period, so
this isn't a side-by-side opinion)

--
Owamanga!
 
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C J Campbell
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      03-07-2005, 09:40 PM

"bmoag" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:ZF_Wd.4838$(E-Mail Removed) m...
> Bascially both these cameras have serious issues.
> Unless you absolutely gotta have one right now I would wait to see Nikon's
> next generation of cameras.
> Short of that I would look into the Canon D20. Those 2 extra mps make a
> world of difference and anyone who doesn't realize that should run for
> Cleopatra's job: Queen of Denial.


Well, 2 more MPs on a smaller chip -- should be noisier, to say the least.


 
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Rainy
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      03-08-2005, 12:25 AM
The Nikon d70 and D100 are both great cameras. Do a search for both cameras
on the net and read as many reviews as possible. all cameras have some
issues including the Canon D20. Please go here for a direct comparison of
the Nikon D70 and The Canon 20D. If money is an issue for you stick with the
Nikon D70 because the Nikon D100 will run you about $200.00 more and the
Canon D20 should run you about $600 more. Good Luck!!


"C J Campbell" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> "bmoag" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:ZF_Wd.4838$(E-Mail Removed) m...
> > Bascially both these cameras have serious issues.
> > Unless you absolutely gotta have one right now I would wait to see

Nikon's
> > next generation of cameras.
> > Short of that I would look into the Canon D20. Those 2 extra mps make a
> > world of difference and anyone who doesn't realize that should run for
> > Cleopatra's job: Queen of Denial.

>
> Well, 2 more MPs on a smaller chip -- should be noisier, to say the least.
>
>



 
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Rainy
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      03-08-2005, 01:00 AM
Please go here for the direct comparison between the Nikon D70 and the Canon
20D. http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/20dd70.htm


"Rainy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> The Nikon d70 and D100 are both great cameras. Do a search for both

cameras
> on the net and read as many reviews as possible. all cameras have some
> issues including the Canon D20. Please go here for a direct comparison of
> the Nikon D70 and The Canon 20D. If money is an issue for you stick with

the
> Nikon D70 because the Nikon D100 will run you about $200.00 more and the
> Canon D20 should run you about $600 more. Good Luck!!
>
>
> "C J Campbell" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> >
> > "bmoag" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> > news:ZF_Wd.4838$(E-Mail Removed) m...
> > > Bascially both these cameras have serious issues.
> > > Unless you absolutely gotta have one right now I would wait to see

> Nikon's
> > > next generation of cameras.
> > > Short of that I would look into the Canon D20. Those 2 extra mps make

a
> > > world of difference and anyone who doesn't realize that should run for
> > > Cleopatra's job: Queen of Denial.

> >
> > Well, 2 more MPs on a smaller chip -- should be noisier, to say the

least.
> >
> >

>
>



 
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Roger
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      03-08-2005, 03:37 AM
On Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:00:58 GMT, Owamanga <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I'm surprised you give ergonomic advantage to the D70, the D100 feels
>better to me.


I agree the D100 feels better, my comments on ergonomics really are
pointed towards the three new buttons on the back of the camera to
manipulate ISO/WB/etc. (can't remember what etc. is right now and I
don't have any pictures available, sorry).

Roger
 
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Roger
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      03-08-2005, 03:39 AM
On Mon, 07 Mar 2005 23:35:36 GMT, "Tom Scales" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

> I own both and don't find the viewfinder
>differences even noticeable, let alone a problem.


Tom,

Do you wear glasses? My glasses sit off my face quit a bit (just can't
change the eyeball to nose bridge distance without major
intervention.) That situation poses problems for me with almost any
but the Nikon high eye-point finders.

Just curious...

Roger
 
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Roger
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      03-08-2005, 04:18 PM
Please see my comments, in line below:

Regards,
Roger

On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 04:44:58 GMT, "GTO" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>For now, I assume that you're already on the Nikon track.


Yes, I am on the Nikon track. However, I also know that for my lens
usage, buying a late model DSLR means pretty much a whole new system
or at least major additions. If I look at the D100 I can keep my
SB80dx flash. My 24, 35 and 50mm lenses will be useful. In the range
where I photograph most often it will require a wide angle lens
replacement and that will likely be a zoom. For my low light needs,
the 17-55mm f2.8 covers about 90% what I want. My 80-200 AFS gets the
rest. So I'm likely looking at a body, strobe, normal coverage fixed
aperture zoom and my tele zoom.
>
>You cannot possibly just ask other users and think you get the right
>recommendation for your personal needs.


I didn't, I asked people to give me some information on what aspects
of two cameras appealed to them. Nits to major flaws and ergonomic
preferences and glitches often come to light when people talk about
how the use equipment, rather than what's on paper.

>You should go to a local camera
>store and borrow a D100 for a couple of days. Then, borrow a D70 and compare
>for yourself.


I'm acquainted with a lot of dealers in the Chicago metro area and I
don't know any who let their cameras go for a few days. I did handle
both cameras for a couple of hours and the proprietor let me take
photos in the store. He was very generous in letting me work around
and with other customers were also looking at these bodies. I answered
questions only when asked directly, did not sell and did not counter
any of the sales staff answers even though several were incorrect. I
did bring my own lenses so the store inventory was enhanced quite a
bit since they didn't have any fast primes and his other customers
also got to use the lenses.

>Asking people in a newsgroup is just not good enough to
>justify such an investment.


Perhaps, but the people in this news group collectively have a wealth
of experience all of which I value, and much of which far surpasses
what I have collected over the years, and that includes your
suggestion that a D2H might be useful in my case.

Can you tell me more about your D2H and what about it meets your
needs.

>
>Remember, depending on your style of photography, a D2H (currently around
>US$1999) may be the better choice. Only you know what you need.


Actually, I do know what I want and it hasn't been offered by Nikon
yet. That's a 6+ MP equivalent of the F100+ or Nikon F6. I NEED a
viewfinder that I can see through with my glasses, and that's a Nikon
High Eyepoint finder (like on my F100, F3 or F5). However, I'm willing
to compromise and search the VF for the exposure information, that's
less of a problem with the D100 than the D70. The camera I buy now
will likely be a backup for something else down the road. The F5
exposure system has spoiled me and the D100 doesn't have that, the D70
does. The D70 also has the much used ISO/WB/QUAL buttons on the back
and not on the D100 dial. The D70 is a candidate because of size and
the mode dials which would make it easier for other members of my
family to use to include me in some photos. The D100 just feels
better, and I'm hoping in the responses to this query that someone
will discuss the ease/difficulty of using the ISO/WB/QUAL on the mode
ring.

>But if you
>don't, buy the cheapest DSLR you can get and experiment.


I'll most likely do that with any camera... I'm an experimentalist, by
training, a photographer by avocation.

>DSLR cameras
>require much practice, many hours of learning and a large pocket book to
>invest in computer HW and SW, printers, and other not exactly cheap
>accessories.


Actually, the reason I'm looking at these two cameras (and not the
D2H) is because of the relatively low price point given the
functionality. I'm thinking that a D70/D100 right now with my existing
24mm f2.8, 35mm f2.8 and 50mm f1.4 lenses will give me quite a bit of
utility. I travel a great deal internationally for business (about
one/two weeks a month) and my photo opportunities are early or late
after meetings - late usually means night street shooting. So a camera
with low noise capability is a plus, compact also counts for a lot.
The D2H doesn't really fit that profile, although I came very close to
buying one at $3200. I'm still not sure whether the D2Hs will be the
right answer for dealing with the low-light photography that I do.

I have a very nice/quality mini-lab a few minutes from my home. They
take Internet-submitted photos and print them in one-hour. It's a
great product and service. So a printer is not on my list. Last month
I submitted some of my digital photos from my hotel room in Budapest
and they were waiting for me when I got home.

> - Finally, after you have purchased all you need for serious
>amateur, digital photography, the investment into the camera body appears
>smaller.


That's the marketing genius of digital photography. $2000 throw away
technology/bodies. Integrate the film into the computer - now you have
two marketing points to build new interest in something that is now
ephemeral but with film, was "geological" in its MTR, Mean time to
Replacement - very rarely failure.

>
>Gregor

 
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Roger
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      03-08-2005, 04:45 PM
On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 10:34:41 GMT, "Tom Scales" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>Yes, sure do. -12 diopter!


I'm sorry, you win in the diopter count. In your original post you
recommended the D70. As I mull this over more and more, I'm also
leaning in that direction. I think the smaller body with a couple of
my fixed focal length lenses (24mm f2.8 and 35mm f2.0) will allow me
flexibility for travel. The built in flash means I can put off getting
a larger unit (I do have a SB80dx) for a while. The kit lens seems
like such a bargain and it would cover the WA range that I need (but
not the best choice for my available light needs). The 17-55mm can
come later.

OTOH, the D100 integrates well (and it's ~$1000 w/ rebate from B&H)
with the SB80dx. My existing lenses still work. But, I'll loose the
price break on the 18-70. I still like the feel of the D100 and the VF
is still marginal for me on the D70. Oh, Well.... Maybe by the time I
figure this out, Nikon will have at least announced the ones we're
waiting for.

Thanks for the input,
Roger

 
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