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VHS to DVD and copy protection signal?

 
 
HQ
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      11-03-2003, 04:32 AM
Hi all,

I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!

Any idea?

HQ
 
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Richard Crowley
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      11-03-2003, 01:50 PM
"HQ" wrote ...
> I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
> on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!


By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
do not have the legal right to copy them.


 
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Craig Scheiner
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Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 06:40 PM
If you bought them, not copied them from rentals, you certainly do have the
legal right to make one copy. It's simple enough to defeat copyguard. You
can do your own web search to find out how. It should take you all of about
15 minutes.
--
Best regards,
Craig Scheiner
Executive Producer
CPS Associates
Video Production and Publication
www.cpsvideo.net

"Richard Crowley" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> "HQ" wrote ...
> > I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> > protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
> > on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!

>
> By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
> copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
> of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
> do not have the legal right to copy them.
>
>



 
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Andys cam
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Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 07:35 PM
That is not true - current legislation makes it offense to defeat copy
protection for any reason.

>If you bought them, not copied them from rentals, you certainly do have the
>legal right to make one copy. It's simple enough to defeat copyguard. You
>can do your own web search to find out how. It should take you all of about
>15 minutes.
>--
>Best regards,
>Craig Scheiner
>Executive Producer
>CPS Associates
>Video Production and Publication
>www.cpsvideo.net
>
>"Richard Crowley" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> "HQ" wrote ...
>> > I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
>> > protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
>> > on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!

>>
>> By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
>> copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
>> of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
>> do not have the legal right to copy them.
>>
>>

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



 
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DK
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Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 10:00 PM
"Andys cam" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> That is not true - current legislation makes it offense to defeat copy
> protection for any reason.


Case law has supported the right to make "backup" copies of legally
purchased copyrighted material, regardless of what the actual legislation
is. Case law has supported the spirit of the copyright law - and case law is
as important as the actual text of the law.


> >If you bought them, not copied them from rentals, you certainly do have

the
> >legal right to make one copy. It's simple enough to defeat copyguard. You
> >can do your own web search to find out how. It should take you all of

about
> >15 minutes.
> >--
> >Best regards,
> >Craig Scheiner
> >Executive Producer
> >CPS Associates
> >Video Production and Publication
> >www.cpsvideo.net
> >
> >"Richard Crowley" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> >news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> >> "HQ" wrote ...
> >> > I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> >> > protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
> >> > on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!
> >>
> >> By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
> >> copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
> >> of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
> >> do not have the legal right to copy them.
> >>
> >>

> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

>
>



 
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Andys cam
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Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 10:33 PM
That used to be the case, but no longer. "Case law" has already supported the
'no defeating of copy protection' statutes. If you can make a 'backup' for
personal use, only without tampering in any way with the copy protrection, then
it is permitted.

>Case law has supported the right to make "backup" copies of legally
>purchased copyrighted material, regardless of what the actual legislation
>is. Case law has supported the spirit of the copyright law - and case law is
>as important as the actual text of the law.


 
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Craig Scheiner
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Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 10:38 PM
This has been legal since I think 1984, when the Supreme Court ruled making
a back-up copy of videos you own is legal. I think you are referring to the
Digital Millennium Copyright Act, or similar name. Copying will remain
legal, copyguard defeated or not, until someone is prosecuted,. found
guilty, appeals, and the Supreme Court reverses its 1984 decision. I think,
since I'm not PTravel. Ask him for an answer you know you can rely on.

--
Best regards,
Craig Scheiner
Executive Producer
CPS Associates
Video Production and Publication
www.cpsvideo.net

"Andys cam" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> That is not true - current legislation makes it offense to defeat copy
> protection for any reason.
>
> >If you bought them, not copied them from rentals, you certainly do have

the
> >legal right to make one copy. It's simple enough to defeat copyguard. You
> >can do your own web search to find out how. It should take you all of

about
> >15 minutes.
> >--
> >Best regards,
> >Craig Scheiner
> >Executive Producer
> >CPS Associates
> >Video Production and Publication
> >www.cpsvideo.net
> >
> >"Richard Crowley" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> >news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> >> "HQ" wrote ...
> >> > I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> >> > protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
> >> > on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!
> >>
> >> By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
> >> copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
> >> of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
> >> do not have the legal right to copy them.
> >>
> >>

> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

>
>



 
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PTRAVEL
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Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 11:13 PM

"DK" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> "Andys cam" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > That is not true - current legislation makes it offense to defeat copy
> > protection for any reason.

>
> Case law has supported the right to make "backup" copies of legally
> purchased copyrighted material, regardless of what the actual legislation
> is. Case law has supported the spirit of the copyright law - and case law

is
> as important as the actual text of the law.


Case law is actually more important than the actual text of the law, since
it is the courts' job to construe the statute, and it will be the courts'
construction that determines how the statute will be applied. However, as
I've discussed in another post, the courts have not permitted making backup
copies, at least to my knowledge.

>
>
> > >If you bought them, not copied them from rentals, you certainly do have

> the
> > >legal right to make one copy. It's simple enough to defeat copyguard.

You
> > >can do your own web search to find out how. It should take you all of

> about
> > >15 minutes.
> > >--
> > >Best regards,
> > >Craig Scheiner
> > >Executive Producer
> > >CPS Associates
> > >Video Production and Publication
> > >www.cpsvideo.net
> > >
> > >"Richard Crowley" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> > >news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >> "HQ" wrote ...
> > >> > I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> > >> > protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some

discussions
> > >> > on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!
> > >>
> > >> By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
> > >> copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
> > >> of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
> > >> do not have the legal right to copy them.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >

> >
> >

>
>



 
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PTRAVEL
Guest
Posts: n/a

 
      11-03-2003, 11:13 PM

"Craig Scheiner" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:s-qdnVs4qeRgRTuiRVn-(E-Mail Removed)...
> This has been legal since I think 1984, when the Supreme Court ruled

making
> a back-up copy of videos you own is legal. I think you are referring to

the
> Digital Millennium Copyright Act, or similar name. Copying will remain
> legal, copyguard defeated or not, until someone is prosecuted,. found
> guilty, appeals, and the Supreme Court reverses its 1984 decision. I

think,
> since I'm not PTravel. Ask him for an answer you know you can rely on.


Okay, a couple of quick points . . .

1. Sony v. Universal found that recording broadcasts for later viewing came
within fair use, i.e. was a complete defense to copyright infringement.
However, that decision was predicated on a belief by the courts that (a) no
one would compile a library of copyright-protected material in this fashion,
and (b) under traditional fair-use analysis, air checks not only didn't
negatively impact the market for the protected broadcast work, but actually
facilitated it, because more people would be exposed to the advertisers'
messages.

Of course, (a), above, turned out to be wrong -- I know lots of people who
have such libraries. Now, with respect to making back-up copies, that does
not come within Sony v. Universal. The Copyright Act permits making a
backup of a _computer program_, which might or might not be, for example, a
DVD or D-VHS recording. It wouldn't permit copying of a VHS tape under the
statute. That leaves only fair use. I don't think the rationale of Sony
v. Universal would apply to backups -- unlike an ephemeral broadcast, tape
and DVD producers, whether the studios or event videographers, depend, in
part, on multiple sales to their customers. Think of the parent whose kid
wears out the Barney tape from multiple replaying. Accordingly, the fair
use argument which prevailed in Sony v. Universal is not completely on point
with backups.

Finally, remember that the makeup of the Supreme Court which decided Sony v.
Universal is quite different from the present court, which is much more
conservative, and much less likely to find a strong First Amendment interest
in an activity which is perceived as having a negative economic impact.

Accordingly, (and I haven't researched this), I'd be inclined to say that
backups probably are not permitted under existing law.

2. Now, on to the more interesting point. There are, without question,
contexts in which making a copy of copy-protected video material would fall
fairly within fair use. However, the DMCA makes illegal use of
copy-protection-defeating devices (actually, it makes the devices,
themselves, illegal). Now, there are fairly easy ways to defeat
Macrovision -- any good TBC (which has substantial non-infringing uses and
wouldn't, therefore, be precluded by the DMCA) can copy
Macrovision-protected material. The question, then, isn't can it be done,
but would doing it violate the DMCA? The answer is: I don't know, and I
don't think anyone else does at this point. The DMCA provides that it does
not limit existing fair use doctrine. However, it is, nonetheless, squarely
at odds with _existing_ provisions of the Copyright Act. For example, the
Audio Home Recording Act (AHRA) defines as non-prosecutable making personal
copies of sound recordings. However, a lot of CD-producers have introduced
CDs which can't be "ripped" by conventional computer software. If I write
and use a program which can rip one of these non-copyable CDs, I've violated
the DMCA, even though that specific activity is authorized by the AHRA.

The DMCA is a very badly drafted piece of legislation (reflecting, no doubt,
the input of entertainment industry lobbyists). Fortunately, it will
probably be revised by Congress within the year to correct some of its more
onerous and contradictory flaws.

Okay, that wasn't that quick. But you and Andy's Cam have correctly
identified one of the inherent contradictions in the DMCA. You're both
right about that one, and it will have to be remedied by Congress.



>
> --
> Best regards,
> Craig Scheiner
> Executive Producer
> CPS Associates
> Video Production and Publication
> www.cpsvideo.net
>
> "Andys cam" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > That is not true - current legislation makes it offense to defeat copy
> > protection for any reason.
> >
> > >If you bought them, not copied them from rentals, you certainly do have

> the
> > >legal right to make one copy. It's simple enough to defeat copyguard.

You
> > >can do your own web search to find out how. It should take you all of

> about
> > >15 minutes.
> > >--
> > >Best regards,
> > >Craig Scheiner
> > >Executive Producer
> > >CPS Associates
> > >Video Production and Publication
> > >www.cpsvideo.net
> > >
> > >"Richard Crowley" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> > >news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >> "HQ" wrote ...
> > >> > I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> > >> > protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some

discussions
> > >> > on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!
> > >>
> > >> By what means do you have the license/rights/permission to
> > >> copy this material? It sounds like you have consumer copies
> > >> of commercial videos with Macrovision. You almost certainly
> > >> do not have the legal right to copy them.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >

> >
> >

>
>



 
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Oleg Kaizerman
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      11-04-2003, 12:00 AM
There is a thing that called TBC (Time Base Corrector) ,stuck it between and
forget :-)

--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
"HQ" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Hi all,
>
> I would like to transfer all my favorite VHSs to DVD but the copy
> protection signal keeps me from doing that. I read some discussions
> on this group but it looks like nobody can do it!
>
> Any idea?
>
> HQ



 
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