16:9, Consumer, High Definition Editing arrival date?

Discussion in 'Amateur Video Production' started by dc, Apr 5, 2004.

  1. dc

    dc Guest

    How soon will the investment in our 4:3 aspect ratio, low def, video gear
    becomes worthless?

    I'm hoping our software will at the least be upgradeable. But I suspect all
    the hardware is doomed.

    Doug
    Oakland, CA
     
    dc, Apr 5, 2004
    #1
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  2. dc

    Barry Guest

    Ulead already has a HDV plug-in for Media Studio Pro. Though a 3 GHz
    processor is recommended it works fine with a 2.4 GHz P4.
     
    Barry, Apr 5, 2004
    #2
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  3. dc

    Jerry Jones Guest

    I shot just a few minutes of HDV using the JVC JY-HD10 the other day
    and used my slowest computer - a 1.67ghz Athlon - to capture the HD
    video using the Ulead HDV plug-in.

    Didn't drop a single frame.

    Yesterday - I shot almost a half hour of HDV video.

    When I get some time, I'll hook up the JVC and see if I can sustain
    capture for a full half hour without dropping frames.

    I suspect it will work - based on the performance I seemed to get
    during my first test.

    Jerry Jones
    http://www.jonesgroup.net
     
    Jerry Jones, Apr 5, 2004
    #3
  4. dc

    Tampax Guest

    Jerry,

    are you able to edit the video and send it out again to the HD camera (on
    DVCAM tape) using it as a VTR? Is there any compression artefact? Are you
    able to use all resolutions, frame rates, etc?
     
    Tampax, Apr 5, 2004
    #4
  5. dc

    Barry Guest

    Currently on a 2.4 GHz P4 it is stopping the capture whenever it hits a new
    scene where the camera had been stopped and then started again. There is no
    gap just a scene change and it may not always do this so I will be curious
    to see if you can actually capture for a straight half hour without it
    stopping. The Pixela capture software that comes with the camera will start
    a new file when there is a scene change. Do you have it installed too (I'm
    wondering if the two can coexist on the same machine)? Ulead has been
    alerted of the problem.
     
    Barry, Apr 5, 2004
    #5
  6. dc

    Jerry Jones Guest

    Yes - I am able to export the edited HIGH DEFINITION video back to the
    JVC JY-HD10 using the Ulead MediaStudio Pro 7.0 HDV Plug-In.

    If one wants to record the video file back to the JVC HDV camcorder,
    one must first export the timeline using either the NTSC JVC HD (TS)
    setting or the NTSC JVC SD (TS) setting.

    The file name extension for this type of video file is M2T (MPEG-2
    Transport Stream).

    The instructions for this are as follows:

    1. Turn on your JVC HDV camcorder and switch it to VTR
    mode;

    2. Select File: Export - DV Recording;

    3. In the Select Video File dialog box, locate the HDV video
    file (M2T) and click Open;

    4. In the HDV Recording - Preview Window dialog box,
    preview the video that you created using the Navigation
    Panel;

    5. When you are done previewing, click Next;

    5. In the HDV Recording - Record Window dialog box, click
    Record to start recording the video to the JVC HDV
    camcorder;

    6. You can view the video being recorded on your camcorder's
    LCD monitor but not on the Preview Window.

    7. Click Transmit to preview the video first on your
    camcorder's LCD monitor before you record the video to your
    camcorder;

    8. Click Finish when you are done recording the video to your
    camcorder.

    I do not see any artifacting.

    The quality is amazing.

    The JVC JY-HD10 records in three modes:

    1. In DV mode, the cameras shoot standard 720 x 480 at 30 frames per
    second or 60 interlaced fields per second in a 4:3 aspect ratio.

    2. In SD mode, the cameras shoot 720 x 480, 60 progressive frames per
    second (60p) in a true 16:9 aspect ratio. This is an MPEG-2 format.

    3. The HD mode records 30p, 16:9 aspect ratio images at 1280 x 720.

    Currently, the SD mode offers a very nice option for projects destined
    for current DVD technology.

    I believe the the HD DVD technology is just around the corner.

    Jerry Jones
    http://www.jonesgroup.net
     
    Jerry Jones, Apr 6, 2004
    #6
  7. dc

    Dave Haynie Guest

    Depends on your current gear's 16:9 capabilities (if any), and your
    demand (personal or business) for 16:9. I've been shooting 16:9 for
    years, and my next camera purchase will definitely be optimized for
    16:9.
    All serious NLE software has supported 16:9 for quite some time. The
    better apps have been adding HDTV support in the last year or two.
    From a software application, it's simply not a huge issue to support
    multiple formats, unless the app is somehow hardwired as a dedicated
    4:3 DV editor.
    You can always fit an animorphic lens to your camcorder. As long as
    you adjust settings, very little in your toolchain has to know it's
    16:9 automatically. DV is DV is DV -- a 16:9 chunk of DV will have a
    "16:9" indicator bit set, otherwise it's identical to a 4:3 chunk of
    DV. Same with MPEG-2.

    Dave Haynie | Chief Toady, Frog Pond Media Consulting
    | Take Back Freedom! Bush no more in 2004!
    "Deathbed Vigil" now on DVD! See http://www.frogpondmedia.com
     
    Dave Haynie, Apr 6, 2004
    #7
  8. dc

    Jerry Jones Guest

    The minimum system requirements for the Ulead HDV Plug-in are as
    follows:

    - Microsoft® Windows® XP
    - Intel® Pentium® 4 3GHz or higher
    - 512MB RAM

    I just tried a longer capture using my below specification AMD Athlon
    1.67ghz computer.

    Yes - I also observe that the high definition video capture stops
    where the scene changes.

    I'm not sure if this is due to the fact I'm using a below
    specification computer or if there's a problem with the plug-in.

    Jerry Jones
    http://www.jonesgroup.net
     
    Jerry Jones, Apr 6, 2004
    #8
  9. dc

    Barry Guest

    It's a bug. They just sent me an update which I've haven't had a chance to
    try yet.
     
    Barry, Apr 6, 2004
    #9
  10. dc

    Dave Haynie Guest

    That's probably just a performance recommendation, given the typical
    speed of HD/MPEG-2 editing.
    Given that the JVC HDcam is only running at DV25 speeds, the capture
    should not be any more intensive than plain old everyday DV25 capture.
    While it's possible there's something additional one needs to do to
    process the capture data, versus DV, there's no good reason that
    couldn't be done in a separate, lower priority task. There's not GOOD
    reason capture itself should be any worse than plain old DV. And DV50
    isn't even slightly stressful for any modern PC.
    That's certainly a software issue, whether on the camera or the
    PC-based capture utility.
    Any MPEG-2 camera is going to have issues with arbitrary scene
    changes, since you don't press "stop" on even GOP boundaries. Not much
    of an issue, anyway, since you're going to edit the video anyway, but
    it's also the case that you can't really capture a whole tape as one
    MPEG stream, the way you can with DV if you want to.

    Does the capture stop if you import the tape as a series of separate
    MPEG-2 files? My only problem with such behaviour would be the fact I
    usually just press the "capture tape" button, than go do something
    else for an hour or so. I would be very angry with a capture tool that
    demands interaction.

    Dave Haynie | Chief Toady, Frog Pond Media Consulting
    | Take Back Freedom! Bush no more in 2004!
    "Deathbed Vigil" now on DVD! See http://www.frogpondmedia.com
     
    Dave Haynie, Apr 6, 2004
    #10
  11. dc

    Jerry Jones Guest

    Barry,

    Could you e-mail me?

    I am also noticing that on my sub-spec 1.67ghz Athlon computer, my HD
    captures exhibit jerky playback.

    Are you seeing this problem as well?

    I'd be interested in obtaining the update as well.

    My e-mail is:



    Jerry Jones
    http://www.jonesgroup.net
     
    Jerry Jones, Apr 9, 2004
    #11
  12. dc

    Barry Guest

    I did. But their update didn't work as the file that was supposed to be
    fixed was the same that the original plug-in had. So they must have an
    installer problem. So the update isn't ready for primetime yet. I let them
    know someone else found the problem.

    Try VideoLan to playback your video. It should play it smoother. It may
    take a 3 GHz to play back smoothly in the Capture program but that's not a
    big problem. Nor is it in the editor which does actually play smoother on
    my 2.4 GHz.

    - Barry
     
    Barry, Apr 9, 2004
    #12
  13. dc

    Jerry Jones Guest

    I've done some further testing.

    Actually, the capture isn't stopping at scene changes after all.

    Instead, the capture stops at what I've identified as a drop-out on
    the Mini DV tape (brand new TDK).

    When I attempt a capture past this trouble spot, the capture continues
    through scene changes without issue.

    However, the 1.67ghz AMD Athlon doesn't appear to have sufficient
    power to capture the transport stream as the video that is captured
    exhibits slight jerkiness during playback.

    Jerry Jones
    http://www.jonesgroup.net
     
    Jerry Jones, Apr 9, 2004
    #13
  14. dc

    Barry Guest

    But the JVC capture doesn't stop capturing at those points! Do you lose
    audio in the capture program at those points?

    Is your edited footage jerky when you record it back to the camera and play
    it back through the camera or HD set?

    - Barry
     
    Barry, Apr 9, 2004
    #14
  15. dc

    Jerry Jones Guest

    I don't yet have an HDTV monitor here at home.

    So I'll have to do that testing with a borrowed monitor here in town.

    Playback is jerky for me - even in the Ulead MediaStudio Pro 7.0 VIDEO
    EDITOR source monitor video window.

    Like I said, I suspect Ulead really meant it when they specified a
    3.0ghz Pentium 4 processor as a minimum.

    I don't think my Athlon 1.67ghz chip is up to the task.

    Since a computer upgrade isn't going to be in my immediate future, I
    am now going to focus my attention on the SD mode instead of the high
    definition mode captures.

    Jerry Jones
    http://www.jonesgroup.net
     
    Jerry Jones, Apr 10, 2004
    #15
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