A 10 and 18 MP Pentax....very nice...

Discussion in 'Pentax' started by m II, Aug 9, 2006.

  1. m II

    m II Guest

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  2. m II

    John Francis Guest

    John Francis, Aug 9, 2006
    #2
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  3. m II

    jeremy Guest


    Pentax has been a disappointment in the digital domain. Why mess with
    Pentax when Nikon and Canon have the product on the shelves right now? It
    is sad that an innovator like Pentax has become a third-tier player in
    digital.
     
    jeremy, Aug 9, 2006
    #3
  4. m II

    Pentax Fan Guest




    It has to be said, Pentax are *very* good at announcing stuff - but that's
    about as far as it goes.

    The 'new' K100 is yet another incarnation of the *istD/Ds/Ds2/DL (the only
    difference is that each variant seems to get cheaper and nastier) with the
    same old 6.1 mp sensor. Not that it's a 'bad' sensor - it's not, but all
    the repackaging in the world can't disguise the fact that technology is old
    enough to have been used by Noah. OK, so there is 'anti-shake' in its
    latest guise, but that's hardly an earth shaking development.

    What is needed is the long promised K10D - but in true Pentax tradition the
    months pass by, and the camera remains firmly out of reach. The Pentax
    faithful at dpreview are consoling themselves with assurances that it will
    be available this September, but that conveniently overlooks the fact that
    Pentax promised only to have a working demo available at Photokina, imo
    there is far more chance of being whisked off to a far flung galaxy by a
    passing Saturnine spaceship than of being able to purchase a K10D before
    next spring/summer.

    Meanwhile, Nikon produce yet another brilliant camera at a price point that
    is going to sweep away the competition. If the Pentax K10D *was* actually
    available now it would still take a beating from the new D80, when (if) it
    finally *does* materialise it will be just another overpriced Pentax
    anachronism - too little, far too late.
     
    Pentax Fan, Aug 9, 2006
    #4
  5. m II

    John Francis Guest

    You're going to be eating those words in a month.
    The D80 isn't on the shelves yet; by the time it is the K10D will be,
    too, and at a lower price.
     
    John Francis, Aug 9, 2006
    #5
  6. m II

    Charlie Self Guest

    As I recall, Pentax promised release of the two new cameras in the
    fall. Last I checked, it was still early August, which doesn't qualify
    anywhere I know of, so any disappointment over their not hitting a
    release date this time seems to be an internal deal.

    If Pentax had the resources of Nikon or Canon, possibly your impatience
    would be justified, but they don't.
     
    Charlie Self, Aug 9, 2006
    #6
  7. m II

    Pentax Fan Guest


    Pentax (to be fair) have never said that their K10D would be available for
    purchase in September - or even this year, for that mater. It's the anxious
    faithful who have persuaded themselves that it will be so

    As for 'on the shelves in a month' , not-a-dogs-chance

    My point is that Pentax, always first to accept the party invitation and
    always the last to arrive, will find the other guests leaving (clutching
    their new Nikon's) by the time they bother to show up.
     
    Pentax Fan, Aug 9, 2006
    #7
  8. Pentax has been a disappointment in the digital domain.

    To some, perhaps, particualrly at the high end. But not to those
    seeking high quality but low cost options.

    ---------------
    Marc Sabatella


    Music, art, & educational materials
    Featuring "A Jazz Improvisation Primer"
    http://www.outsideshore.com/
     
    Marc Sabatella, Aug 10, 2006
    #8
  9. The 'new' K100 is yet another incarnation of the *istD/Ds/Ds2/DL (the
    Maybe not earth-shattering, but something Canon & Nikon don't offer.
    The only way to get this on their systems is to buy into a whole new set
    of expensive lenses.

    In any case, some of us buy cameras not because of how new the
    technology is, but how well it works...
    A beating in terms of sales figures, sure, that's likely. Just as the
    D50 probably outsells the DL. Doesn't make it a better camera by any
    means.

    ---------------
    Marc Sabatella


    Music, art, & educational materials
    Featuring "A Jazz Improvisation Primer"
    http://www.outsideshore.com/
     
    Marc Sabatella, Aug 10, 2006
    #9
  10. m II

    Tony Polson Guest


    The same comments apply to the film domain. After the MX and LX, the
    only serious (semi-)pro Pentax SLR was the MZ-S, and that was the
    bastard child of the proposed 6 MP full-frame MZ-D that never saw the
    light of day thanks to the exceptionally noisy chip that would have
    been shared with the Contax N Digital.

    Thankfully, Pentax survived, which is more than can be said for
    Contax.

    Pentax, Minolta/Sony and Olympus, are all firmly in the consumer-grade
    DSLR market. Let no-one be under any illusions; these brands do not
    sell to pros and never will, because they cannot possibly hope to sell
    enough high-end bodies to justify the cost of their development.

    So if Pentax, Minolta/Sony and Olympus users are hoping for high end
    bodies to compete with the Nikon D2X or Canon EOS 1D(s) Mk II, they
    should forget their dreams and buy Nikon or Canon. Sony's dream of
    one day competing with Nikon is just that - a dream.

    There is a chance that the 645-based Pentax 18 MP DSLR will sell to
    pros, as the 645 film SLRs still have a wide pro following. But the
    35mm-based Pentax (and Minolta/Sony) DSLRs will only ever appeal to
    low-end amateurs for the reasons I stated above.

    The Four Thirds DSLRs from Olympus, Panasonic and Leica might have
    some pro appeal because of the optical excellence of the Zuiko and
    Leica Digital glass. However, the sensor size has proved to be
    severely limiting. There cannot be much hope of a good, low noise 10+
    MP Four Thirds DSLR for a year or two at least, and perhaps never.
     
    Tony Polson, Aug 10, 2006
    #10
  11. m II

    John Francis Guest

    You've got that backwards. The MZ-D was the bastard child of the MZ-S.
    The MZ-S was a last sop to the traditional film user who wanted the same
    old-style controls as the MZ series of cameras, not the body-mounted
    aperture controls of the semi-pro Pentax you missed - the PZ-1p.
    The same could have been said of Canon 30 years ago. If you are
    prepared to put a big enough investment in professional services,
    etc., you can buy the market. Pros have no brand loyalty; they'll
    buy whatever is cost effective to get the job done. Not that I
    expect Pentax to go after that market, at least in a K-mount body.
    Pentax have cameras to sell to the advanced amateur (aka prosumer),
    and seem to want to stay in that market. They'll never compete for
    the 1Ds or D2X purchasers, but there's enough of a market selling
    to the potential D200/30D customer for that to be worthwhile, as
    well as a chance to compete for new first-time DSLR purchasers.
     
    John Francis, Aug 11, 2006
    #11
  12. m II

    Paul Mitchum Guest

    Pentax is keeping us all waiting on the 645 body that begins to fill
    that gap. Only a) no one has 645 stuff, and b) those that do want a full
    frame, so they're just using film. Perhaps that's why it's still
    vaporware.
     
    Paul Mitchum, Aug 11, 2006
    #12
  13. m II

    farqua Guest

    Quite trollish.
     
    farqua, Aug 17, 2006
    #13
  14. m II

    Charlie Self Guest

    Odd. The announcement earlier this year noted that the final details
    would appear at Photokina, some 5 or 6 weeks in the future at this
    moment. "Long awaited" doesn't really tell an accurate story.

    As for Pentax being a disappointment in the digital field, I'll take my
    *istD over any Canon or Nikon with similar features. It may be an
    "overpriced Pentax anachronism" but, so far, it has turned out
    thousands of great pictures for me, at a cost well below what I'd have
    had to pay for equivalent results with a Canon or Nikon.

    In your opinion, purchase won't be possible before 2007's spring or
    summer. Let's wait and see, but that's about the time I'll be wanting
    to step up to the K10D if it has the features expected and the 10MP
    sensor is good enough as a replacement for the current 6MP.
     
    Charlie Self, Aug 17, 2006
    #14
  15. FWIW, the latest rumors - which sound quite plausible to me - are that
    the "K10D" to be announced next month at Photokina will be yet another 6
    MP camera, not the 10 or 12 MP camera many were expecting. The reason
    being that Pentax was supposedly unhappy with the noise levels of the
    available 10 and 12 MP CCD sensors. Based on initial reaction to the
    new Sony, this wouldn't surprise me one bit.

    Some people are obviously very sensitive to pixel count, and consider
    this news disastrous to Pentax. I'm not so sure. Not everyone has any
    real reason to care about the difference between 6 and 10 MP, but some
    of the other improvements that are generally expected to be seen in the
    K10D could easily be worthwhile for a great many people. I personally
    would be much more excited by any number of body / control design
    improvements than I would be more MP, as incentive to upgrade from my
    DS. Even if it were just basically a D with SR added, that would still
    be a significant step up in many ways (although I'm happy enough with my
    DS that I doubt I'd be willing to actually do so). To someone who is
    actually comparing based on camera usability and functionality as
    opposed to any perceived "newness" of the technology, such a camera
    would still absolutely blow away anything else in its expected price
    range (just under $1000). And the only way to get anything
    significantly "better" (read: 10-12 MP, or perhaps FF) would be to spend
    quite a bit more, but then you would have to give up the SR. I'm not at
    all convinced that this is really the right tradeoff for the majority of
    people. Although of course, pixel count is easier to market than the
    arguably more significant factors that might count in the K10D's favor,
    so I do fully expect Pentax to take an (undeserved) beating over this if
    the rumors prove true.

    ---------------
    Marc Sabatella


    Music, art, & educational materials
    Featuring "A Jazz Improvisation Primer"
    http://www.outsideshore.com/
     
    Marc Sabatella, Aug 19, 2006
    #15
  16. m II

    RichA Guest

    I hope Pentax sticks around. They don't have much money, but they make
    some excellent telescopes.
     
    RichA, Aug 20, 2006
    #16
  17. Some people are obviously very sensitive to pixel count, and consider
    I would like 10 or 12 mp. Some of the places that I try to submit
    pictures are very sensitive about the size for no reason. I do think
    that my 6mp DL is too soft and doesn't get pictures as sharp as the Canon.
    I swear that it just seems like this.

    I would really like better processing in the camera and reduced time to
    do it. I need a bigger buffer in the camera as well. If I have a
    composition with lots of dynamic range it takes forever to save to the
    card. When I'm shooting these types of pictures I often want to try for
    10 shots. I used to be able to fire off 10 shots in 10 seconds and I can't
    do it. This is one of the big reasons why a friend still shoots slides.

    bill


    --
     
    William O'Hara, Aug 20, 2006
    #17
  18. I do think
    It is indeed a commonly observed fact that Pentax does not apply much
    sharpening to its JPG files, compared to most others. The standard
    advice is to shoot RAW and do the sharpening in post processing, if you
    like that kind of sharpening applied.

    ---------------
    Marc Sabatella


    Music, art, & educational materials
    Featuring "A Jazz Improvisation Primer"
    http://www.outsideshore.com/
     
    Marc Sabatella, Aug 21, 2006
    #18
  19. m II

    ian Guest

    Amateur photog swears by genuine fractals. Apparently a nice clean noise
    free image such as from a 6mp canon sensor blows up quite nicely.

    If you only have adobe then blow up 10% at a time rather than 100% in one
    step. This is a technique i have found successful.
     
    ian, Aug 21, 2006
    #19
  20. m II

    ian Guest

    Samsung have taken them under their wing? Hopefully the optics stay pentax
    and design. Samsung can handle electronics.They are a better brand than
    they used to be.
     
    ian, Aug 21, 2006
    #20
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