Adobe - Photoshop and their "Subscriptions"

Discussion in 'Digital Cameras' started by gamer_reg, Jun 4, 2013.

  1. gamer_reg

    gamer_reg Guest

    I have been a Photoshop user since the very first release of the
    software for the PC way back in what, 1990? 1994?? Both personal and
    at all of the screenprinting companies I managed over the years and
    right up to my own personal photography work. I looked at GIMP once,
    Same with COREL..... and a few other wannabe's.

    Through all the years I've been a loyal Adobe customer and never
    really considered anything else as the Photoshop products always did
    well for me.

    Over the weekend I purchased a Nikon D3200 camera. This camera uses
    NEF-Compressed RAW format. I use Photoshop CS3 mostly out of laziness
    in updating. Also though there is the cost with seeming annual
    upgrades. CS3 did everything I need it to do so if it ain't broken
    don't fix it.

    My research and updating of CS3 let to naught as those of you in the
    "know" will nod your heads to. So I figured I would call Adobe and
    learn what the cost would be to upgrade.

    Imagine my surprise when I learned of Adobe's current Subscription
    demands to have the privilege of using their products.

    I understand some Harvard MBA's brilliant idea in try to develop a
    "locked in" customer base. I mean isn't that what every business
    wants? A SECURE market share! I understand some Fisk Economics PhD
    coming up with the idea that a steady flow of cash would be far easier
    to manage than the normal ebb and flow of cash trending. It cuts into
    your sailing and golf time to actually have to MANAGE your cash flow
    doesn't it?

    So now I am faced now with being a long time and loyal customer of yet
    another economic STEAMROLLER in the form of a massive corporation that
    begs for my hard earned $$$ without wanting to work as hard at
    customer SERVICE as I must in MY business.

    This locked in customer base, whether it is a 2 year cell phone
    CONTRACT or an ongoing subscription for the privilege of using Adobe's
    products is, in my humble Opinion complete and utter bullshit.

    Let's try this concept: Develop a Superior Product. Sell it at a fair
    market price by BUILDING VALUE in your product. THEN secure your
    market share through EXEMPLARY customer service and support! THAT is
    how you build a LOYAL customer base and market share!

    In short I would like all these overpaid MBA's to go a little OLD
    SCHOOL and learn what CUSTOMER SATISFACTION is all about and what
    satisfied customers mean to the health of a major company. Didn't they
    teach you in your MBA classes that Loyal customers grow from HAPPY and
    PLEASED buyers that perceive VALUE form the spending of their hard
    earned dollars on your products!

    That's not good enough for the Marketing Gestapo today though. They
    know that the state of customer service in America today is pathetic!
    They KNOW they cannot compete toe to toe AND piss off their clientele
    with crappy service! So, they figure a captive clientele is better.

    No It's not! Now I find alternatives to Photoshop. When I leave a
    company with my loyalty crapped on...I will never go back.

    This is going to hurt Adobe badly...... Oh and the ONLY people diving
    feet first into this CLOUD bullshit like Adobe and every other company
    is touting so heavily.......is the WORST idea EVER. You might as well
    give your sensitive information to the Taliban!

    Farewell Adobe...... It's been nice but I'm done with y'all!
     
    gamer_reg, Jun 4, 2013
    #1
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  2. gamer_reg

    Guest Guest

    if cs3 was doing everything you needed all this time, then you don't
    need to update to cs6 or creative cloud.

    photoshop elements for $60 is all you need.

    rest of your rant snipped.
     
    Guest, Jun 4, 2013
    #2
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  3. gamer_reg

    Alan Browne Guest

    I didn't read most of your rant but here's what you do:

    1. Get the free Adobe DNGConverter to convert your raw files to DNG.

    2. Keep using CS3 as before.
     
    Alan Browne, Jun 4, 2013
    #3
  4. gamer_reg

    Savageduck Guest

    We feel your pain. :-(
    This has been discussed in the photo NGs at some length, and many of us
    here have discussed, and weighed the pro & cons of the Adobe "Creative
    Cloud" (CC). Many of us have decided that CS6 is the end of the Adobe
    upgrade treadmill. Few of us here are pro-photographers, or graphic
    artists/designers and we have chosen to stick with CS5 or CS6 and go no
    further.

    Personally, over the years I have paid for PS7, PS-CS, then up graded
    to CS2, CS3, CS4, CS5, & finally CS6. I use Lightroom 4 (LR4)+CS6 in my
    workflow.

    The Adobe upgrade path changed several years ago and for you an upgrade
    from CS3 to CS5 dead-ended some time ago. You are correct the only
    purchasable upgrade you could make today is CS5 to CS6. So, your
    purchase options are to pay $699 to Adobe for the last of their
    inventory, or $650 via Amazon for the last of their inventory. None of
    those are appealing.

    Now that you have a new camera which is not supported by ACR in your
    CS3, you have several options:
    1: Search out other available software options.

    2: Stick with CS3 and add Lightroom 4 , currently available for $97.99
    from Amazon. This will give you all you need for cataloging and
    processing of current RAW files, and you will still be able to use CS3.
    (this is the solution I recommend)
    There are some advantages to this as you would be using the 2012 RAW
    process engine, which is a vast improvement over the 2003 version in
    CS3.

    3: Download the current version of the free DNR convertor from Adobe,
    and continue with CS3.

    ....or 4: Take a deep breath and consider the actual annual cost of the
    subscription model for single module rental of Photoshop compared to
    $699 purchase or $199 upgrade. The initial offering of $10/month for a
    single module for the first year, $120/year vs $199 for an upgrade, or
    $120/year vs $699 for a purchase of CS6. After the initial offering the
    single module rental goes to $20/month or $240/year and a permanent
    upgrade path. You still get to have two installations desktop/laptop.
    If I was not a retired old fart, I might well consider the CC
    subscription route.
     
    Savageduck, Jun 4, 2013
    #4
  5. gamer_reg

    Guest Guest

    that also works.
     
    Guest, Jun 4, 2013
    #5
  6. gamer_reg

    Savageduck Guest

    ....er DNG Converter.
     
    Savageduck, Jun 4, 2013
    #6
  7. gamer_reg

    gamer_reg Guest

    Thank you both very much. Sorry about the rant.... Been months since I
    had a good one and that certainly did not qualify as a good one.
    However I am disapointed in Adobe. Actually I started out just to say
    I thought this was going to hurt them. Also, this is what I get for
    having lived in a cave for a couple of years.

    Elements you say? Hummm. DNG. Had not gotten that far into the problem
    solving. Been to enraptured with the new camera. You both have,
    magnanimously given me a couple of directions to pursue. Thank you for
    your generosity and for mercifully snipping the rest of a poor rant
    aired in the wrong place.
     
    gamer_reg, Jun 4, 2013
    #7
  8. gamer_reg

    philo  Guest


    <snipped for brevity>


    Since I do minimal processing , GIMP is way more than I need...however
    most of my professional level friends do use Photoshop and it sure can
    get pricey to upgrade. Last time I heard, if it's more than one level
    you have to start new.

    Many of the folks are just staying with CS-2 and are saying they see
    nothing in the newer versions they really need.
     
    philo , Jun 4, 2013
    #8
  9. gamer_reg

    Savageduck Guest

    The issue comes for owners of new cameras who shoot RAW. They do not
    have the ACR support for their new cameras in the dated version of ACR
    in CS2, or in the OP's case CS3.

    For Mac users with the move from PPC Macs to Intel there are even fewer
    options, as the Intel Macs will not run CS2, unless in a Windows
    partition.

    The various options for the OP to deal with the NEF files from his new
    DSLR were discussed further back in this thread.
     
    Savageduck, Jun 4, 2013
    #9
  10. gamer_reg

    philo  Guest



    Yes, I saw that.

    It's a shame that Adobe does not have a less expensive upgrade option,
    obviously they are in business to make money...but they are even more
    aggressive than Microsoft.
     
    philo , Jun 4, 2013
    #10
  11. gamer_reg

    Guest Guest

    they do.

    it's called photoshop elements and is typically around $60.

    anyone who is still using cs2 or the gimp would find the current
    version of elements to be an upgrade (significantly so in the case of
    the gimp).
    no they aren't. unlike microsoft, adobe publishes file formats,
    including photoshop's. that makes it very easy to switch to a
    competitor, some of whom already support photoshop files.

    contrast that with microsoft, where if you want to read one of their
    proprietary formats, you need to license it, and it's often not that
    cheap. they even invented their own programming language to lock people
    in.
     
    Guest, Jun 4, 2013
    #11
  12. gamer_reg

    Alan Browne Guest

    I didn't say Elements at all.

    I said: 1) Get the free DNG converter and 2) _continue_ using CS3 with
    the DNG files instead of the NEF.
     
    Alan Browne, Jun 4, 2013
    #12
  13. gamer_reg

    Tony Cooper Guest

    You would pick up some features that are of real use by going to the
    current version of Elements. It's been quite some time since I used
    CS2, but I have the feeling that Elements is much more advanced in
    features.

    "Need" is not a definable criterion. What one person needs is not the
    same as what others need. "Want" is probably what more of us go for
    than "need".

    Many of us - amatuers, that is - that are using CS6 could do just
    about as well without it in post processing our photographs, but we
    like playing with stuff. Some play too much.

    As far a GIMP goes, it isn't Photoshop and it doesn't have the
    features that Photoshop has...by a long shot. But, if it has the
    features that *you* feel are sufficient, it's state-of-the-art.
     
    Tony Cooper, Jun 4, 2013
    #13
  14. gamer_reg

    Tony Cooper Guest

    Well, there is. Elements is $99.99 if you order from Adobe. You'll
    see a $60 figure bandied about, and you can get it for that, but if
    you are more comfortable dealing directly with the source then the
    Adobe price is reasonable.

    It's an "upgrade", even if it's not a new version of a current
    program, if it's a replacement program that offers more features.
    Is there a better reason to commit your time and resources to a
    business?
     
    Tony Cooper, Jun 4, 2013
    #14
  15. gamer_reg

    Guest Guest

    i suggested elements.
    the most recent version of elements will be far more convenient than
    that.

    however, dng converter is free.
     
    Guest, Jun 4, 2013
    #15
  16. gamer_reg

    Guest Guest

    the gimp is in no way state of the art.

    it might be 'good enough' but it's 10 years out of date with poor
    performance too.
     
    Guest, Jun 4, 2013
    #16
  17. gamer_reg

    PeterN Guest

    So far, I have found DXO is a better than decent RAW converter, with
    more capability than ACR. I will have a more informed opinion as I
    continue to learn the produce and they come out with the promised
    upgrade to permit selective adjustments.
     
    PeterN, Jun 5, 2013
    #17
  18. gamer_reg

    Guest Guest

    on sale for $69 thru father's day, directly from adobe.
    nothing wrong with buying it elsewhere.
     
    Guest, Jun 5, 2013
    #18
  19. gamer_reg

    Paul Ciszek Guest

    FWIW, I didn't like what DNG did to the image quality of some of my
    Olympus OM-D pictures.
     
    Paul Ciszek, Jun 5, 2013
    #19
  20. gamer_reg

    Paul Ciszek Guest

    Does GIMP support more than 8 bits per color channel yet? Last I checked,
    it was still just talk.

    Also, I tried installing the add-ons that were supposed to make GIMP (under
    Linux) able to read camera raw files, but they didn't work.
     
    Paul Ciszek, Jun 5, 2013
    #20
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