Archival quality DVDs/CDs

Discussion in 'Australia Photography' started by David Morrison, Jan 4, 2007.

  1. I am starting to think about long term storage for my digital photos.
    Boxes of prints and slides last almost forever, but a failed DVD can
    lose everything on it.

    Are there brands of DVD that are more robust than the generic ones you
    buy for a dollar each?

    Thanks

    David
     
    David Morrison, Jan 4, 2007
    #1
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  2. David Morrison

    Chris Guest

    While searching for print media I came across this site:
    http://www.imagescience.com.au/CD_DVD/cddvdHome.html
    How good this brand of media is I cannot vouch for as i havn't used them
    before.
    In terms of DVD being a reliable long term storage I would never rely on
    them especially from experience. A company I work for routinely backs all
    images after a photoshoot and then again after they been worked on into
    DVDs. A situation arose where all the previous years work become
    inaccessable/corrupted on the file server and were forced to using the DVDs
    to restore the files. Only problem is many of them had tiny scratches, a few
    looked like the dye had deteriorated and several files were permanently lost
    on a number of Discs. Since then they have resulted to using high capacity
    external drives.
     
    Chris, Jan 4, 2007
    #2
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  3. David Morrison

    googlegroups Guest

    If you go the DVD route then I would recommend you try to source DVDs
    from two unique OEMs (not just the same OEM with different branding).
    That way if you run into a bad batch there is less chance of losing
    your data, as you have a duplicate on the other brand of DVD. For extra
    redundancy duplicate the lot again and store one set of brand A and
    brand B onsite, the other set offsite.

    I've been thinking about using HDs myself, as they will be less bulky
    than a stack of DVDs. I expect my collection of digital photographs
    will approach 500Gb by the end of this year so managing 200+ DVDs
    (including duplicates) would be difficult. I would use at least two HDs
    with identical content stored at different locations, and choose a
    maximum reliable lifetime before they're unconditionally replaced. The
    data would also be stored on my main PC for further redundancy.
     
    googlegroups, Jan 4, 2007
    #3
  4. David Morrison

    Poxy Guest

    I've heard that Taiyo Yuden are meant to be the ducks guts in DVD-R's. This
    bunch flog them:

    http://www.jpldisplays.com.au

    I've only been using them for a few months, so couldn't really say whether
    the claims of superior quality are justified.
     
    Poxy, Jan 4, 2007
    #4
  5. David Morrison

    k Guest

    | I am starting to think about long term storage for my digital photos.
    | Boxes of prints and slides last almost forever, but a failed DVD can
    | lose everything on it.
    |
    | Are there brands of DVD that are more robust than the generic ones you
    | buy for a dollar each?



    from:
    <http://www.dvd-recordable.org/Article1325-mode=thread-order0-threshold0.pht
    ml>

    A new DVD defect management study, conducted by Media Sciences, and
    sponsored by the RAM Promotion Group (RAMPRG), reveals that DVD-RAM drives
    provide the most robust, drive-based defect management among currently
    available recordable DVD formats. An optional protective cartridge offers
    even greater protection and reliability for DVD-RAM.


    ...but hard drives are cheaper

    or test the media with kprobe:
    from http://www.cdrlabs.com/kprobe/index.php
    (2.1Mb download)
    allows you to test dvd's by looking at the errors on the disks.


    the outcomes and experiences have been listed here:

    http://www.videohelp.com/dvdmedia
    princo AND TDK DVD's (and others) scored a GOOD rating, interestingly there
    are substantially more user comments, most very good, on Princo than the
    nest nearest commented upon brand.. 297 V 74 comments

    seems that the reviewers also get to state how many disks they've burned
    too - some of the reviewers have burnt a mere _single_ disk on which
    they've based their reports - the Princo brigade however all seem to have
    burnt 25, 100, 50 etc .

    I think the *best* way to resolve this is to check the error count on the
    various disks available and then treat the results as a guide*. As is
    stated there, compatibility is NOT a good guide to reliability, only the
    error count gives a true indication of fallibility.

    *as with film, every batch is different and because one review says their
    lot tested good doesn't mean the batch I buy tomorrow are also going to be
    as good



    and http://www.dvdinfopro.com/

    DVDINFOProT by Nic Wilson is a DVD information program written in Visual
    C++ for Windows 95, 98, 98SE, ME, NT, 2000, XP.The program provides
    information & tools for

    DVD-R/RW
    DVD+R/RW burners
    DVD+R DL (Double Layer) burners
    DVD-ROM players.
    It also provides information on CD players & burners.

    "I get a lot of emails asking me how I produce my media test graphs and
    where do I find the drives and media information.
    Well the answer is DVDInfoPro produced by Nic Wilson
    This program provides me with all the drive information, media information
    and also produces all the graphs & charts I need to carry out my reviews.
    "

    http://www.dvd-recordable.org/wwwimgs/media/flash/dvdinfopro/dvdinfoproadver
    t.zip
    Free Version with embedded adverts 1.59meg.

    www.DVDrecordable.org - another good site for reviews on optical media and
    drives


    hope this helps

    k
     
    k, Jan 5, 2007
    #5
  6. David Morrison

    kosh Guest


    I saw a full review of dvd blank media in PC user.
    a point to note was that it was their second full review.... in that
    time many had changed their standards.

    If I recalll correctly they raved about TDK the first time round, but
    found they had changed their supplier, and the second round of tests
    turned to crap for TDK.

    the moral of the story.... burn many, print lots on proper phtoo
    paper... non of this dye-sub crap (kodak kiosks)

    kosh
     
    kosh, Jan 5, 2007
    #6
  7. A photographer friend mentioned that he is using "armour plated" DVDs
    which are apparently toughened so that they don't suffer so much from
    physical damage. I saw some "scratch resistant" DVDs in OfficeWorks
    yesterday, made by Imation and TDK. Wonder if they are the same ones?

    He is also looking at using DVDs made with gold as this is less prone to
    corrosion than the aluminium on most DVDs.

    Cheers

    David
     
    David Morrison, Jan 6, 2007
    #7
  8. David Morrison

    k Guest

    "David Morrison

    A photographer friend mentioned that he is using "armour plated" DVDs
    which are apparently toughened so that they don't suffer so much from
    physical damage. I saw some "scratch resistant" DVDs in OfficeWorks
    yesterday, made by Imation and TDK. Wonder if they are the same ones?



    | He is also looking at using DVDs made with gold as this is less prone to
    | corrosion than the aluminium on most DVDs.



    DVD's unlike CD's are laminated and thus inherently safer than CD's as the
    dye and reflective layer are protected by an additional polycarbonate layer
    and thus already 'armored'. they're also supposedly sealed at the edges
    (inner and outer) with adhesive to prevent moisture and air getting in and
    attacking the reflective layer. GOld really wont increase stability if the
    edges are well sealed. If you check each dvd you intend to burn and find
    the edges are NOT well sealed you can seal them yourself with nailpolish -
    allow it to dry and you've got as good a DVD as you can ask for :)

    CD's on the other hand need that backing protected. I've seen a lot of
    funky, cool designs that leave the silver backing showing through some
    stencilled design. not good at all! Likewise when you can see the metallic
    edges visible. Again this can be dealt with, though i'd recommend buying a
    different brant straight up, protect by spraying laquer over the metalwork.
    Hardly worth the effort though..

    regards

    karl
     
    k, Jan 6, 2007
    #8
  9. k wrote:
    ....
    Couldn't help but chuckle when I saw this.. Recently I went through a
    large number of old CD's (no, not DVD's, I know) to see which were
    still usable after a few years.

    And there was only one brand that had more than one failure - EVERY one
    of my Princo CD's (5) had lost either some or *all* data. Of the other
    50-odd disks I checked, another 3 were faulty, but they were no-name
    generics. Perhaps the Princos were all from a defective batch - they
    had all discoloured horribly - but they had all been stored in their
    covers in a normal household environment. Thankfully nothing terribly
    important lost, just some audio and image collections that were backed
    up elsewhere - but I won't go near that brand again.
     
    mark.thomas.7, Jan 8, 2007
    #9
  10. David Morrison

    Mr.T Guest

    Yes I chuckled too. Princo CD's were considered crap, and my experience with
    their early DVD's was just the same. They may have improved, but I'm sure
    not going to find out.

    MrT.
     
    Mr.T, Jan 9, 2007
    #10
  11. David Morrison

    k Guest

    "Mr.T

    | Yes I chuckled too. Princo CD's were considered crap, and my experience
    with
    | their early DVD's was just the same. They may have improved, but I'm sure
    | not going to find out.
    |


    I was furious with princo some years back after spending a reasonable sum
    and buying a bunch of DVD-RW of which EVERY one failed at burn and none were
    able to be recovered. rewrite my ass! Later burners were all pointed at
    the disks on the off chance it was a burner issue - all failed to render
    them in the least bit useful so I have approximately 50 coasters - hence the
    fury

    Later buying a bunch of 10,000 DVD-R's I somehow scored 500 Princo DVD-R's
    in the order and with no expectations ran a number of them through the tests
    only to discover they were *quite* different from the earlier efforts from
    Princo. That was some 3 years back now and *all* those disks still perform
    nicely :)

    seems the burner contributes a fair degree too to the write success and data
    failure rate (not a great surprise) - have a peek here half way down :
    http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?t=96901
    not that the original article author has anything nice to say of them, but a
    later reviewer comments that one burner he has shows a fair error rate after
    a short span of time while another burner had a very different error rate.

    not that this relates to your experience buying princo cd's - which I have
    no experience with given they are crap.

    why on earth would you have bought them? or anything that uses cyanine
    dyes..

    k
     
    k, Jan 12, 2007
    #11
  12. David Morrison

    kosh Guest

    just on the side.... I got a set of pricos.... absolute crap... and this
    was ona brand new burner which has not missed a beat since.

    kosh

    oh... and sometimes I can't be bothered writing KOSH in the signature...
    just 'k' - no offence meant to

    kosh
     
    kosh, Jan 12, 2007
    #12
  13. David Morrison

    Mr.T Guest

    For Audio disks, I usually tried both types in a player for compatibility.
    Some players preferred cyanine disks.
    However I never said I ever used Princo CD's, what I said was they "were
    considered crap".
    My first box of 10 DVD's were Princo's simply because they were all I could
    get at the time. (this was years ago) I haven't used them since.

    And yes some burners don't like any disks, then there are disks that don't
    like any burners!.

    MrT.
     
    Mr.T, Jan 12, 2007
    #13
  14. David Morrison

    k Guest

    | oh... and sometimes I can't be bothered writing KOSH in the signature...
    | just 'k' - no offence meant to

    none taken!

    I can't be bothered writing Karl is why I go for k

    ;)

    k
     
    k, Jan 12, 2007
    #14
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