Bad Glass

Discussion in 'Photography' started by Dallas, Nov 24, 2013.

  1. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that my glass is really bad. It's
    a TAMRON AF 28-300 3.5-6.3 XR - $384.30 (the first version from 10
    years ago).

    My concept was to connect it to my Canon 5D and never change it... "a
    full frame super zoom" for travel photos... no messing around with big
    bags and changing lenses. I'm ok with it's performance in the 28mm to
    130mm range, but at 300mm it never seems to be crisp.

    In fact I'd call it horrible? I'd like your opinion:

    http://tinyurl.com/kfbbwde
    F stop 10, ISO 400, Speed 1/1000

    http://tinyurl.com/m5z65sw
    F stop 10, ISO 400, Speed 1/800

    1) Does it suck? How bad?
    2) Does anyone make good glass in a wide angle to zoom lens?



    --
    Dallas
     
    Dallas, Nov 24, 2013
    #1
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  2. Dallas

    Alan Browne Guest

    On 2013.11.24, 16:39 , Dallas wrote:
    >
    > I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that my glass is really bad. It's
    > a TAMRON AF 28-300 3.5-6.3 XR - $384.30 (the first version from 10
    > years ago).
    >
    > My concept was to connect it to my Canon 5D and never change it... "a
    > full frame super zoom" for travel photos... no messing around with big
    > bags and changing lenses. I'm ok with it's performance in the 28mm to
    > 130mm range, but at 300mm it never seems to be crisp.


    High zoom ratios are typically soft towards the long end - I avoid
    anything over 3:1 or so unless proven to be very sharp at the long end
    (my 2 zooms are constant aperture 2.5:1 - the rest are FFL).

    Over 10:1 in your lens. At $384 you can't expect miracles.

    --
    "The radio was once expected to promote international understanding and
    co-operation;
    it has turned out to be a means of insulating one nation from another."
    -George Orwell, 1945
     
    Alan Browne, Nov 24, 2013
    #2
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  3. Dallas

    Savageduck Guest

    On 2013-11-24 21:39:02 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> said:

    >
    > I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that my glass is really bad. It's
    > a TAMRON AF 28-300 3.5-6.3 XR - $384.30 (the first version from 10
    > years ago).
    >
    > My concept was to connect it to my Canon 5D and never change it... "a
    > full frame super zoom" for travel photos... no messing around with big
    > bags and changing lenses. I'm ok with it's performance in the 28mm to
    > 130mm range, but at 300mm it never seems to be crisp.
    >
    > In fact I'd call it horrible? I'd like your opinion:


    This is a case of expecting better performance from a budget lens than
    it is capable of delivering.

    > http://tinyurl.com/kfbbwde
    > F stop 10, ISO 400, Speed 1/1000


    That is not a particularly useful shot to evaluate any lens.

    > http://tinyurl.com/m5z65sw
    > F stop 10, ISO 400, Speed 1/800


    A better shot, but also tough to use to make a decent evaluation.

    > 1) Does it suck? How bad?


    If you use it within its limitations it will be OK. Otherwise is is an
    average to mediocre lens which has been pushed beyond its performance
    envelope.

    > 2) Does anyone make good glass in a wide angle to zoom lens?


    How fat is your wallet?
    ....and what sort of zoom range are you actually looking for? Any lens
    with an extreme wide-long range is going to be compromise and will have
    a decided sweet spot.

    I use a Nikkor 18-200mm AFII as my walk-around lens, I get reasonable
    results with that, but my 70-300mm is sharper, as is my Tokina 11-16mm,
    and my 35mm.
    Sometimes you just have to carry those extra lenses.

    That said, I have heard good things about the new edition of the Tamron
    18-270mm you might want to check that and reviews. Possibly see if a
    bricks & mortar camera store will let you test drive a lens.
    < http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/tamron_18-270_3p5-6p3_vc_n15 >



    --
    Regards,

    Savageduck
     
    Savageduck, Nov 25, 2013
    #3
  4. Dallas

    Ian Guest

    "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> wrote in message
    news:p...
    >
    > I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that my glass is really bad. It's
    > a TAMRON AF 28-300 3.5-6.3 XR - $384.30 (the first version from 10
    > years ago).

    < snip >
    > Dallas


    Hello Dallas.

    When my 17-85mm lens failed I thought of getting a Canon wide-tele zoom
    (probably the 18-135mm or 18-200mm) to use on my 50D. I hoped I could mostly
    leave my 55-250mm lens in the bag (or perhaps sell it). I looked at some
    reviews sites and they seemed to be not overly enthusiastic about these
    lenses. I eventually bought a Canon 15-85mm lens and so now, of course, my
    55-250mm lens still has a use.

    Regards from Nottingham,
    Ian.
     
    Ian, Nov 25, 2013
    #4
  5. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    Savageduck wrote:

    > How fat is your wallet?


    I'm married. :- )

    > That said, I have heard good things about the new edition of the
    > Tamron 18-270mm you might want to check that and reviews. Possibly
    > see if a bricks & mortar camera store will let you test drive a lens.
    > < http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/tamron_18-270_3p5-6p3_vc_n15 >



    That's a good idea.


    Perhaps this is a better one to evaluate:
    http://tinyurl.com/l7q5f82

    Focal length 209mm, F 14, 1/1000, ISO 1000

    .... then there's this which is not bad for 300mm. Maybe I'm just a
    whiney baby.
    http://tinyurl.com/lufrkjg

    Focal length 300mm, F9, 1/500, ISO 500



    --
    Dallas
     
    Dallas, Nov 25, 2013
    #5
  6. Dallas

    Savageduck Guest

    On 2013-11-25 22:30:23 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> said:

    > Savageduck wrote:
    >
    >> How fat is your wallet?

    >
    > I'm married. :- )
    >
    >> That said, I have heard good things about the new edition of the
    >> Tamron 18-270mm you might want to check that and reviews. Possibly
    >> see if a bricks & mortar camera store will let you test drive a lens.
    >> < http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/tamron_18-270_3p5-6p3_vc_n15 >

    >
    >
    > That's a good idea.
    >
    >
    > Perhaps this is a better one to evaluate:
    > http://tinyurl.com/l7q5f82
    >
    > Focal length 209mm, F 14, 1/1000, ISO 1000


    I think that is quite acceptable. It is a tad soft in some areas such
    as the clock face, but the detail is still pretty good.

    > ... then there's this which is not bad for 300mm. Maybe I'm just a
    > whiney baby.
    > http://tinyurl.com/lufrkjg
    >
    > Focal length 300mm, F9, 1/500, ISO 500


    Again this is quite acceptable regarding detail. This is one of those
    lenses where it seems you can get acceptable captures if the lighting
    is good and the exposure parameters are not pushed into the area of
    unreasonable expectations.
    So I would say, if you understand the quirks of this lens you might be
    able to milk some functionality out of it matched to your 5D.

    --
    Regards,

    Savageduck
     
    Savageduck, Nov 26, 2013
    #6
  7. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    Savageduck wrote:

    > Again this is quite acceptable regarding detail. This is one of those
    > lenses where it seems you can get acceptable captures if the lighting
    > is good and the exposure parameters are not pushed into the area of
    > unreasonable expectations.



    I was pretty distressed with this recent batch of photos, but you've
    calmed me down a bit.. and that's a good thing.




    --
    Dallas
     
    Dallas, Nov 27, 2013
    #7
  8. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    Ian wrote:

    > When my 17-85mm lens failed I thought of getting a Canon wide-tele
    > zoom (probably the 18-135mm or 18-200mm) to use on my 50D. I hoped I
    > could mostly leave my 55-250mm lens in the bag (or perhaps sell it).
    > I looked at some reviews sites and they seemed to be not overly
    > enthusiastic about these lenses. I eventually bought a Canon 15-85mm
    > lens and so now, of course, my 55-250mm lens still has a use.



    My mistake might have been being in love with the concept of a big SLR.
    I've seen some photos from some good super zooms that make mine look
    pretty bad. Carting one of those around would sure make life easier.
    But, sometimes emotions trump reason.


    --
    Dallas
     
    Dallas, Nov 27, 2013
    #8
  9. Dallas

    Noons Guest

    On 25/11/2013 8:39 AM, Dallas wrote:

    > I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that my glass is really bad. It's
    > a TAMRON AF 28-300 3.5-6.3 XR - $384.30 (the first version from 10


    Aye!....

    >
    > 1) Does it suck? How bad?


    Actually the second shot is not half bad, although not spectacular
    definition. The first one entirely sucks. Don't get me wrong: it's a
    nice concept, I am not referring to that!

    > 2) Does anyone make good glass in a wide angle to zoom lens?


    I'm not aware of any with superb quality. But Tamron would be at the
    bottom of my list for ANY lens or zoom range, with perhaps the exception
    of their 90mm macro. The rest nowadays IME sucks badly.

    Still, like someone else said: horses for courses, you may well be able
    to get good stuff out of it if you don't push the envelope too much.
    Learn to live with the limitations, yaddayaddaetcetc.

    I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you mean
    as far as wallet sizes go...
     
    Noons, Nov 27, 2013
    #9
  10. Dallas

    Noons Guest

    On 27/11/2013 5:36 PM, Dallas wrote:

    > My mistake might have been being in love with the concept of a big SLR.
    > I've seen some photos from some good super zooms that make mine look
    > pretty bad. Carting one of those around would sure make life easier.
    > But, sometimes emotions trump reason.


    Psst: look at micro4/3 or one of the new Fuji system cameras.
    I did and there is no way I'll ever spend much moolah on a full size
    dslr ever again!
     
    Noons, Nov 27, 2013
    #10
  11. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    Noons wrote:

    > I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    > mean as far as wallet sizes go...


    Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    without prior approval.


    --
    Dallas
     
    Dallas, Nov 27, 2013
    #11
  12. Dallas

    Savageduck Guest

    On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> said:

    > Noons wrote:
    >
    >> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    >> mean as far as wallet sizes go...

    >
    > Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    > was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    > without prior approval.


    ....and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    mentioning it.

    --
    Regards,

    Savageduck
     
    Savageduck, Nov 28, 2013
    #12
  13. Dallas

    Dallas Guest

    Savageduck <
    > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even mentioning it.


    True Dat!

    $400 shoes... What's the problem?

    --
    Dallas
     
    Dallas, Nov 28, 2013
    #13
  14. Dallas

    PeterN Guest

    On 11/27/2013 8:03 PM, Savageduck wrote:
    > On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com>
    > said:
    >
    >> Noons wrote:
    >>
    >>> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    >>> mean as far as wallet sizes go...

    >>
    >> Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    >> was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    >> without prior approval.

    >
    > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    > mentioning it.
    >


    We can spend over 200 for dinner. When I spend a few bucks for a new
    camera or lens.... I have learned long ago not t0 mention these matters
    in advance. Even if I concede, I get the, "how could you even thought of
    doing that...." When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    discussion.

    --
    PeterN
     
    PeterN, Nov 28, 2013
    #14
  15. Dallas

    Noons Guest

    On 28/11/2013 3:46 PM, PeterN wrote:


    > When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    > discussion.
    >



    Yup, same approach here.
    Hey it works, and the pain is short and quick!

    ┬ŽD
     
    Noons, Nov 28, 2013
    #15
  16. Dallas

    Robert Coe Guest

    On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 23:46:46 -0500, PeterN <>
    wrote:
    : On 11/27/2013 8:03 PM, Savageduck wrote:
    : > On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com>
    : > said:
    : >
    : >> Noons wrote:
    : >>
    : >>> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    : >>> mean as far as wallet sizes go...
    : >>
    : >> Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    : >> was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    : >> without prior approval.
    : >
    : > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    : > mentioning it.
    : >
    :
    : We can spend over 200 for dinner. When I spend a few bucks for a new
    : camera or lens.... I have learned long ago not t0 mention these matters
    : in advance. Even if I concede, I get the, "how could you even thought of
    : doing that...." When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    : discussion.

    It ought to be obvious that the solution to the problem is to get your wife or
    girlfriend interested in photography. ;^)

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 7, 2013
    #16
  17. Dallas

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/7/2013 10:46 AM, Robert Coe wrote:
    > On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 23:46:46 -0500, PeterN <>
    > wrote:
    > : On 11/27/2013 8:03 PM, Savageduck wrote:
    > : > On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com>
    > : > said:
    > : >
    > : >> Noons wrote:
    > : >>
    > : >>> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    > : >>> mean as far as wallet sizes go...
    > : >>
    > : >> Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    > : >> was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    > : >> without prior approval.
    > : >
    > : > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    > : > mentioning it.
    > : >
    > :
    > : We can spend over 200 for dinner. When I spend a few bucks for a new
    > : camera or lens.... I have learned long ago not t0 mention these matters
    > : in advance. Even if I concede, I get the, "how could you even thought of
    > : doing that...." When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    > : discussion.
    >
    > It ought to be obvious that the solution to the problem is to get your wife or
    > girlfriend interested in photography. ;^)
    >


    The year we will have been married for 54 years. She was 15 when we met.
    I have tried, but water...horses....


    --
    PeterN
     
    PeterN, Dec 7, 2013
    #17
  18. Dallas

    Robert Coe Guest

    On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 11:17:37 -0500, PeterN <>
    wrote:
    : On 12/7/2013 10:46 AM, Robert Coe wrote:
    : > On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 23:46:46 -0500, PeterN <>
    : > wrote:
    : > : On 11/27/2013 8:03 PM, Savageduck wrote:
    : > : > On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com>
    : > : > said:
    : > : >
    : > : >> Noons wrote:
    : > : >>
    : > : >>> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    : > : >>> mean as far as wallet sizes go...
    : > : >>
    : > : >> Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    : > : >> was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    : > : >> without prior approval.
    : > : >
    : > : > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    : > : > mentioning it.
    : > : >
    : > :
    : > : We can spend over 200 for dinner. When I spend a few bucks for a new
    : > : camera or lens.... I have learned long ago not t0 mention these matters
    : > : in advance. Even if I concede, I get the, "how could you even thought of
    : > : doing that...." When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    : > : discussion.
    : >
    : > It ought to be obvious that the solution to the problem is to get your wife or
    : > girlfriend interested in photography. ;^)
    : >
    :
    : The year we will have been married for 54 years. She was 15 when we met.
    : I have tried, but water...horses....

    My wife already had a 35mm camera (a Sears Tower) when we met. When it died, I
    bought her a Minolta. When that died, she wanted to be able to share my
    lenses, so I bought her a Nikkormat. The rest is history.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 8, 2013
    #18
  19. Dallas

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/7/2013 7:45 PM, Robert Coe wrote:
    > On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 11:17:37 -0500, PeterN <>
    > wrote:
    > : On 12/7/2013 10:46 AM, Robert Coe wrote:
    > : > On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 23:46:46 -0500, PeterN <>
    > : > wrote:
    > : > : On 11/27/2013 8:03 PM, Savageduck wrote:
    > : > : > On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com>
    > : > : > said:
    > : > : >
    > : > : >> Noons wrote:
    > : > : >>
    > : > : >>> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    > : > : >>> mean as far as wallet sizes go...
    > : > : >>
    > : > : >> Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    > : > : >> was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    > : > : >> without prior approval.
    > : > : >
    > : > : > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    > : > : > mentioning it.
    > : > : >
    > : > :
    > : > : We can spend over 200 for dinner. When I spend a few bucks for a new
    > : > : camera or lens.... I have learned long ago not t0 mention these matters
    > : > : in advance. Even if I concede, I get the, "how could you even thought of
    > : > : doing that...." When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    > : > : discussion.
    > : >
    > : > It ought to be obvious that the solution to the problem is to get your wife or
    > : > girlfriend interested in photography. ;^)
    > : >
    > :
    > : The year we will have been married for 54 years. She was 15 when we met.
    > : I have tried, but water...horses....
    >
    > My wife already had a 35mm camera (a Sears Tower) when we met. When it died, I
    > bought her a Minolta. When that died, she wanted to be able to share my
    > lenses, so I bought her a Nikkormat. The rest is history.
    >

    Both of our daughters have a keen interest in photography. One is quite
    good. She has been asked to put on a one woman show at an embassy. Due
    to pressures at work she declined. Needless to say, both use Nikons. I
    really wish my wife would be interested, but although she has decent
    artistic talent, she just has no interest. She will take iPhone pictures
    at times. When I bring her on a photo shoot, she usually stays in the
    car and reads.


    --
    PeterN
     
    PeterN, Dec 8, 2013
    #19
  20. Dallas

    Tony Cooper Guest

    On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 21:53:46 -0500, PeterN
    <> wrote:

    >On 12/7/2013 7:45 PM, Robert Coe wrote:
    >> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 11:17:37 -0500, PeterN <>
    >> wrote:
    >> : On 12/7/2013 10:46 AM, Robert Coe wrote:
    >> : > On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 23:46:46 -0500, PeterN <>
    >> : > wrote:
    >> : > : On 11/27/2013 8:03 PM, Savageduck wrote:
    >> : > : > On 2013-11-27 23:53:09 +0000, "Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com>
    >> : > : > said:
    >> : > : >
    >> : > : >> Noons wrote:
    >> : > : >>
    >> : > : >>> I know, it sucks. But I'm married too so I know exactly what you
    >> : > : >>> mean as far as wallet sizes go...
    >> : > : >>
    >> : > : >> Ha... one of the first shocks I had when I got married 20 years ago
    >> : > : >> was that I was no longer authorised to make "guy stuff" purchases
    >> : > : >> without prior approval.
    >> : > : >
    >> : > : > ...and yet she still gets to make "gal" stuff purchases without even
    >> : > : > mentioning it.
    >> : > : >
    >> : > :
    >> : > : We can spend over 200 for dinner. When I spend a few bucks for a new
    >> : > : camera or lens.... I have learned long ago not t0 mention these matters
    >> : > : in advance. Even if I concede, I get the, "how could you even thought of
    >> : > : doing that...." When I mention it after the purchase, there is only one
    >> : > : discussion.
    >> : >
    >> : > It ought to be obvious that the solution to the problem is to get your wife or
    >> : > girlfriend interested in photography. ;^)
    >> : >
    >> :
    >> : The year we will have been married for 54 years. She was 15 when we met.
    >> : I have tried, but water...horses....
    >>
    >> My wife already had a 35mm camera (a Sears Tower) when we met. When it died, I
    >> bought her a Minolta. When that died, she wanted to be able to share my
    >> lenses, so I bought her a Nikkormat. The rest is history.
    >>

    >Both of our daughters have a keen interest in photography. One is quite
    >good. She has been asked to put on a one woman show at an embassy. Due
    >to pressures at work she declined. Needless to say, both use Nikons. I
    >really wish my wife would be interested, but although she has decent
    >artistic talent, she just has no interest. She will take iPhone pictures
    >at times. When I bring her on a photo shoot, she usually stays in the
    >car and reads.


    I'm in the same situation, and neither my wife nor I would change it.
    After almost 50 years of being married (and I think you have a few
    more than that), we don't mind going our own way sometimes. No
    scheduling problems; I just go when I want to go.

    She does enjoy the road trips where my interest is in taking
    photographs and her interest is visiting shops. Any kind of shop.
    She's not a big spender, but she is a big looker.

    My daughter's the one that shares my interest. She and I go out
    together when we're in the same town.

    My only problem with the two of them is that they are not critical
    enough of my photographs. I think the amateur photographer needs
    critical review.

    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
     
    Tony Cooper, Dec 8, 2013
    #20
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