beseler 23c questions

Discussion in 'Darkroom Developing and Printing' started by Matt Clara, Jan 10, 2004.

  1. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    Well, I just received my beseler 23c. It was in parts, which was expected.
    There's a light spun-aluminum cylinder that's partially in the upper
    bellows. It seems it should ride higher than that. I've been trying to
    work it up, but the top part of the enlarger is tapered inside, so it won't
    go up. Does this metal part belong inside the upper bellows? If so, should
    it ride right down at the bottom of it? The metal thing is labeled Aristo,
    and, Model Beseler 23c. I can read this information and see the thing
    through a hinged door on the enlarger chassis, just above the upper bellows.
    I would have thought that would be where I'd slide in condensors, or
    filters, or something.

    Any help you can give would be much appreciated.

    regards
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 10, 2004
    #1
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  2. I think I understand what you're saying. I went over to my 23C to check just
    now. On mine, the cylindrical barrel under the filter drawer is what holds the
    condensers; it sounds like yours has a cold-light head, hence the "Aristo", so
    I can't help you there. But yes, this cylinder fits inside the metal collar
    at the top of the upper bellows, and is simply held there by friction. On
    mine, the collar will only go all the way up when the lamphouse is in its
    lowest position (i.e., for 6x9 negatives). All that really matters in this
    area is that it's (relatively) light-tight.

    That drawer is for filters, not condensers. If you have a condenser, it hangs
    underneath the lamphouse; its flange simply slides on top of the rails at the
    bottom of the filter compartment.
     
    David Nebenzahl, Jan 10, 2004
    #2
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  3. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    ok, so it's an aristo cold lamp. I assume it's supposed to ride at the
    bottom of the upper bellows ontop of the white piece of glass/plastic--I was
    a little confused because the enlarger also came with condensors and a lamp
    fixture for the top of the enlarger. There are two cords coming off the
    aristo: I'm not sure what the second one does--something about a thermostat?
    In any case, I've nothing to plug it into--can the head be used without this
    device? I'll plug it in and see. Looks like there's no way to use filters
    above the lens--do filters even work with an aristo cold lamp? I can always
    switch to the condensors!

    regards
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 10, 2004
    #3
  4. Matt Clara

    dddd Guest

    dddd, Jan 10, 2004
    #4
  5. When I used an Aristo on a 23, I recall the milk glass being the
    bottom layer, held in the tube just above the negative carrier. The
    aristo assembly sat down upon that and the cords went up through the
    old condenser bulb cap. I would sandwich my above-lens filters above
    the negative holders. I recall needing the upper bellows down as far
    as possible or I would get vignetting. Perhaps there is a better way
    but an alternative never looked obvious to me and I was getting decent
    results.
     
    Craig Schroeder, Jan 10, 2004
    #5
  6. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    Thanks, Craig;
    I've been to the aristo site, and from what I gather, there were 23c cold
    heads with two cords and ones with three. Mine has two, one presumably to
    heat the lamp and the other to run to a box supplying power to the head,
    which in turn would plug into the wall. I don't have that box:
    http://www.aristogrid.com/prod02CC_BES23C.htm (see last picture on the
    page).
    Is this box essential or could I add a switch and plug to the cord itself?
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 10, 2004
    #6
  7. I assume you would need the power supply to function. I wonder if the
    seller has it around somewhere and just didn't realize what it was
    part of? It was a bit fiddly to deal with the filters that way and I
    switched to a dichro awhile back. The Aristo stuff seems to go pretty
    high on the auction site but maybe you could find a power supply
    there? Somewhere on the web or in a magazine, I recall seeing
    a modification/fabrication that allowed a homemade filter drawer to be
    inserted above the negative for easier use with the Aristo. Does
    someone out there know where to find info?
     
    Craig Schroeder, Jan 10, 2004
    #7
  8. It just dawned on me..... this was an article on the Omega D2
    modification in the March/April Photo Techniques magazine. I was
    thinking when reading it that it would likely be applicable to the
    Beseler.

    On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 13:26:32 -0600, Craig Schroeder

    I recall seeing
     
    Craig Schroeder, Jan 10, 2004
    #8
  9. From all reports, it helps a lot to eliminate negative "popping".

    I solved that problem very easily: all you need to do is get a piece of
    ordinary single-strength window glass and cut a piece that will just fit into
    the filter compartment slots. This kills two birds with one stone: absorbs
    heat (enough so that I've never had a problem with negative popping), and
    provides support for filters (my enlarger came without the filter holder).
     
    David Nebenzahl, Jan 10, 2004
    #9
  10. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    I've ascertained that I need a powersupply box if I'm to use the Aristo
    head. In the meanwhile I figure I'll use the condensors that came with the
    enlarger, so I went online to find assembly instructions (and yes, I've
    already bought a manual for the enlarger on ebay, but it isn't here yet and
    likely won't be for several days). The first thing I find talk of is heat
    absorbing glass--my enlarger has no heat absorbing glass.

    How essential is heat absorbing glass when using condensors?

    Thanks,
    mc
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 10, 2004
    #10
  11. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    I apologise if this message appears twice, but I can't see my first even
    though I posted it nearly an hour ago (my news service is always very quick
    about that).


    How essential is heat absorbing glass when using condensors? Will I destroy
    negatives if I don't use it?
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 10, 2004
    #11
  12. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    Ok, this is my third time to make this post, so if all three show up, I
    apologize. I'm not seeing them, in any case.

    How essential is heat absorbing glass when using condensors?
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 11, 2004
    #12
  13. Matt Clara

    Matt Clara Guest

    Thanks, David. I had to go to Google Groups to see this--please
    ignore my repeats of the question.
     
    Matt Clara, Jan 11, 2004
    #13
  14. Matt Clara

    John Guest

    John, Jan 11, 2004
    #14
  15. The heat absorbing glass protects the filters in the filter draw the lamp.

    Sheldon Strauss
    www.shel.focalfix.com
     
    Sheldon Strauss, Jan 11, 2004
    #15
  16. The first cord supplies voltage to turn the lamp on/off. The other
    provides current to a heater. The bulb light intensity varies (a lot)
    with bulb temperature. The heater keeps the bulb at its operating
    temperature whether it is on or off. Plug it in 10 minutes before
    starting your print session.

    [If you are printing and your exposures are all over the map, you forgot
    to plug in the heater. BTDT]

    Lem Johnson
     
    Lemuel Johnson, Jan 13, 2004
    #16
  17. Matt Clara

    Mike Wilde Guest

    No, it will not destroy your negatives. It is meant to protect
    against colour shift in colour printing filter packs, that see the
    light of the bulb many times more than any negative would.
     
    Mike Wilde, Jan 15, 2004
    #17
  18. Matt Clara

    geo Guest

    The idea of a heat absorbing glass is to prevent (or at least delay)
    negative popping due to heat. It's still a crapshoot because you still never
    know when the neg will pop and sooner or later it will. When it does you've
    wasted a sheet of paper and several minutes. That's why I love my Durst
    Pictochrom - no neg popping during exposures of more than 5 min. If you do
    even moderate printing it pays to get a lightsource with efficient cooling
    unless you don't mind wasting time pre-popping the negative or always use
    glass carriers which constantly need to be dusted..

    Natural Light Black and White Photography
    http://mysite.verizon.net/geost/
    -George-
     
    geo, Jan 16, 2004
    #18
  19. So why is it that I've never experienced negative popping with my Beseler 23C,
    which only has 1 piece of ordinary window glass in the filter drawer? This is
    even when printing 6x9 negs in a glassless carrier.

    I guess I must just be lucky, huh?
     
    David Nebenzahl, Jan 17, 2004
    #19
  20. The glass if it came from Besseler is a special heat absorbing glass which
    was only needed if you use the filter draw. The enlarger lamp head is
    convection cooled. Considering the size of the condenser I don't think much
    heat from the lamp makes it to the negative. I have been using a 23c for
    over thirty years and never a had negative pop. Why would be making an
    exposure of five minutes anyway, what kind of paper were you using?

    Sheldon Strauss
    www.shel.focalfix.com
     
    Sheldon Strauss, Jan 18, 2004
    #20
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