Canon Elan 7NE or Minolta Maxxum 7

Discussion in 'Minolta' started by Swirl The World, Nov 2, 2004.

  1. Swirl The World

    Sander Vesik Guest

    In my tripod based tests, my old Sigma 28-70 f/2.8 simply ate the
    24-120VR for lunch so it ended up not being bought. Sure, it would
    have many advantages when hand held but the defects woudl *still*
    be there, so all I would gain is the ability to take bad shots in a
    limited set of circumstances where I would otherwise get no shot at
    all. Not worth it at all.
     
    Sander Vesik, Nov 14, 2004
    #61
    1. Advertisements

  2. Swirl The World

    Skip M Guest

    It is, indeed, the Angenieux derived design, and it is possible that I have
    a remarkable version of the Canon 28-135, there seems to be a wide sample
    variation reported for that lens. But my wife's and her cousin's iterations
    match mine, all three of us shoot pretty much the same, Ilford XP-2 for film
    and 20Ds for digital. So I'm not sure if the reports of mediocrity aren't a
    little exaggerated.
     
    Skip M, Nov 14, 2004
    #62
    1. Advertisements

  3. Swirl The World

    Skip M Guest

    Hmm, so now we have the 28-135 IS that is better than the Tokina 28-70
    f2.6-2.8 that is better than the Sigma 28-70 f2.8 (check photodo's tests for
    confirmation) that is better than the Nikon 24-120 VR. Which means, if we
    take all our examples as being representative, that the Canon 28-135 IS
    leaves the Nikon 24-120 in the dust...
    I did a comparison of my 28-135 IS and my Tokina on a tripod shooting a
    quilt that had varying textures on it. The Canon was sharper, edge to edge
    and at the center, was slightly warmer and had a little bit of CA.
     
    Skip M, Nov 14, 2004
    #63
  4. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    Ok, interesting. Thanks!
     
    Magnus W, Nov 14, 2004
    #64
  5. Swirl The World

    Alan Browne Guest

    Oh you devil! Congrats! I can't wait to hear your comments, observations and
    see some posts. Here or on the rpd / rpd.slr-s.

    What did you pay?
    Did you get the body or the kit?
    (Here, I am told, the first month only the kit (28-100 + 2500D) is available and
    then the body solo will be available after a month...)

    I know a couple people locally who have it on order with delivery promised
    around the 17th or so... one fellow ordered his without even checking the price.
    (Same guy who sold me the 300 f/2.8 and TC's).

    Cheers,
    Alan


    --
    -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
    -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
    -- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
    -- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
    -- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
     
    Alan Browne, Nov 14, 2004
    #65
  6. Swirl The World

    Alan Browne Guest


    post man, post! Frankly the Minolta 300 f/2.8 is not that sharp a lens to begin
    with, disappointing for a prime.

    How do you feel about the A-S indicators info?

    Cheers,
    Alan

    --
    -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
    -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
    -- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
    -- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
    -- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
     
    Alan Browne, Nov 14, 2004
    #66
  7. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    Tben yours may be smacked around, because mine is fine, delivering very
    sharp slides even with the 2x APO II TC. Get it checked or cleaned would be
    my advice...
    You'll have to wait a few moments for it to "settle down" -- it starts at
    max indication and then goes down. But I haven't really shot seriously with
    it yet, just toying around, and I haven't read the manual... of course...
    ;-)
     
    Magnus W, Nov 14, 2004
    #67
  8. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    It's a substantial camera, with much more feeling and build quality than
    the 7. In fact, it is approaching the 9, outclassing D70, the two *ists,
    300D of course, E-300 (E-volt) and even the 20D. As a side note, the E-300
    and *ist DS are truly unattractive cameras, cheap and slow and nasty. AF is
    fast and more silent than on previous Minoltas. The camera is very fast in
    operation, but could use a bigger buffer (but we knew that already). No
    real drawbacks discovered so far, only minor niggles (metering selector
    "knob" is re-rotated as on the 9 which means it is going to move by
    brushing against the clothes, the USB port cover goes the wrong way so it
    has a tendency to fall down by itself).
    I got the body only and our Swedish prices may not be relevant to you. I
    paid close to SEK 14000 which is about USD 2000 I guess. The VC is next on
    my list, KM people told me that it was shipping but of course I don't know
    how much they know :p

    Could have gotten it a hundred bucks cheaper if I had waited 'til next week
    but I didn't want to risk being left out of the first shipment -- have no
    idea how fast they will sell -- so I went and got it from the first store
    that had it in stock (they had four and mine was the first sold). I am
    pretty certain I got the first unit in Sweden, outside Minolta that is.
     
    Magnus W, Nov 14, 2004
    #68
  9. Swirl The World

    Alan Browne Guest

    It has been both and slides do appear quite sharp. Last cleaning (rear) was
    last year.

    I was referring to the sharpness numbers that are posted at photodo v. lenses
    such as the Canon and Nikon equivalents. (Okay so my statement above is a bit
    strong, I just expect primes to post well into the 4.X on 5 range).

    Minolta: 3.7 / 5.0
    Nikon: 4.0 / 5.0 (Nikkor AF 300/2,8 IF-ED
    4.2 / 5.0 (Nikkor AF-I 300/2,8 IF-ED)
    Canon: not measured by photodo
    Never read the manual until you develop bad habits based on trying to figure the
    device out.

    Cheers,
    Alan.


    --
    -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
    -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
    -- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
    -- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
    -- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
     
    Alan Browne, Nov 14, 2004
    #69
  10. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    Well, those numbers are meaningless. The problem with the 300/2.8 (old) is
    the too short and stupid hood, the fact that you can screw the lens apart
    when trying to remove said hood when the threads bind, and the ugly bokeh.
    Otherwise it's a fine unit, methinks, one of my sharpest.
     
    Magnus W, Nov 14, 2004
    #70
  11. Swirl The World

    Alan Browne Guest

    I've never had a problem with the hood, other than it is too short. I add a
    Nikon hood to that to get a much deeper hood.

    Bokeh is fine, IMO.
    http://www.aliasimages.com/images/TimeOutREVAS.jpg

    Cheers,
    Alan.


    --
    -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
    -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
    -- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
    -- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
    -- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
     
    Alan Browne, Nov 15, 2004
    #71
  12. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    In fact, that's not very good, even though it's an easy subject. I still
    see the problem easily but it's not that evident in the picture you posted.
    Try a scene with twigs or grass in the background. Bad case of "double
    lines".
     
    Magnus W, Nov 15, 2004
    #72
  13. Swirl The World

    Alan Browne Guest

    There's a difference between good bokeh and bokeh so harsh that it takes away
    the scene ... please post what you mean...

    --
    -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
    -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
    -- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
    -- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
    -- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
     
    Alan Browne, Nov 15, 2004
    #73
  14. Swirl The World

    Mark² Guest

    I do own them, and I can testify that they are absolutely deserving of their
    superior-quality reputation. I just sold my 100-400 IS (only so I could
    purchase teh printer I needed even more)...but still have my 16-35L and
    70-200 2.8 IS L. These two lenses are literally stunners if you're moving
    even from excellent consumer lenses. My non-L lenses are also fabulous,
    though, including the 50mm 1.4 and 100mm 2.8 Macro. While these two aren't
    L, they are fantastic, and are frankly right there in terms of optical
    quality. I've also owned the 75-300 IS and will admit that it's not the
    greatest optically...but that lens was a world-class breakthrough when it
    first came out as the very first IS lens.
     
    Mark², Nov 28, 2004
    #74
  15. Swirl The World

    Mark² Guest

    When it can be demonstrated that Minolta's body-based IS is equally
    effective with wides as well as super teles, perhaps you'll have a real
    point. I haven't seen anything that indicates it is prepared to deal with
    the movements involved with long teles...which is, of course, far more
    dramatic than you'll suffer with a shorter lens (like 17-85 or 28-135). If
    you know of such information, please point to it since I'd like to read it.
    I know it can be "applied" to any lens, but it's effectiveness at long focal
    lengths has not been clearly detailed.
    You can't buy a "camera" independant of the lenses it uses, so that is a
    rather vague statement.
     
    Mark², Nov 28, 2004
    #75
  16. Swirl The World

    Mark² Guest

    A disappointing comment.
     
    Mark², Nov 28, 2004
    #76
  17. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    Then you haven't been looking. I have successful 1/30 shots with 300/2.8 +
    2x APO TC (900mm equiv). I do also have 1/30 and 1/20 shots with the 500/8
    mirror tele (750mm equiv) but this lens is much harder to hand hold due to
    its low weight.

    Consider this: Minolta aren't claiming "1/15 at all focal lengths". Rather,
    they are claiming "two to three stops of improvement compared to normal
    sane speeds". I have found this to be generally true. You see, at 900mm the
    swings are indeed huge, but the system isn't trying to correct more than it
    can -- if it could correct everything you could hand hold for hours. At low
    focal lengths, the micro movements of your body (muscle vibration) are
    irrelevant, they won't show up, and AS corrects for the larger swings your
    body makes. At high focal lengths the system would shoot the sensor through
    the camera body if it tried to correct the larger body swings, and
    concentrates on the smaller shakes, which were irrelevant at wide angels
    but now of course are large due to magnification. The larger (but slower)
    body swings are frozen because of the shutter speed used (and they must be
    higher than with a wide angle lens to be able to freeze, etc). Frequency
    and amplitude. It corrects different wave forms depending on focal length.
    It's got exactly the same problem as other stabilization systems, namely
    moving stuff with a fixed mass around with speed and precision. All systems
    have a limit in speed and travel.
    Was that so hard to grasp? You can place different amounts of emphasis on
    the accessories to your camera body, the lens being one of them. What I am
    saying is that this emphasis should be at a level of, or very close to,
    zero (0) for a first time buyer. First choose a camera body that you like
    and see to it that a manufacturer's lens comes with it. Then choose
    accessories when you have identified your needs.
     
    Magnus W, Nov 28, 2004
    #77
  18. Swirl The World

    Bill Tuthill Guest

    Magnus, if you were buying today, would you get the 300/2.8 G again, or
    the 400/4.5 G, or the 200/2.8 G with TC? The last would be most flexible
    and with DLSR might be long enough for wildlife and birds.
     
    Bill Tuthill, Nov 29, 2004
    #78
  19. Swirl The World

    Magnus W Guest

    I already have the 200/2.8 with TC, which is a good combo, but lacks tripod
    mount. The 300/2.8 is good but not stunning; it's not my best lens, in the
    top five maybe but not /the/ best. The drawback of using TCs is the
    significant gear reduction that's inside the Minolta TCs. For the 2x, it's
    4:1, which makes all lenses manual focus -- it's much much faster to focus
    by hand. So, the lenses have somewhat different purposes.

    If I was buying /today/, my choice would be the 70-200 SSM with its matched
    TC, which has mechanical couplings for older lenses (probably
    significantly "downshifted" too) but with the SSM lens having an internal
    motor you wouldn't lose speed... but then again, it's after all a zoom with
    all its drawbacks... decisions decisions... ;-)

    This didn't help much I guess ;-)
     
    Magnus W, Nov 29, 2004
    #79
  20. The same lens on a dSLR will just give you lesser angle of view and not
    more magnification. The alleged *magnification* is when you print both,
    35mm film and a smaller CCD image, to the same size.

    - Siddhartha
     
    Siddhartha Jain, Nov 30, 2004
    #80
    1. Advertisements

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments (here). After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.