Cross processing B&W in C-41 chemistry

Discussion in 'Darkroom Developing and Printing' started by Ken Hart, Aug 11, 2003.

  1. Ken Hart

    Ken Hart Guest

    I'm trying to simplify my darkroom. I do so little B&W that nearly every
    time I need developer, I have to make a new batch. According to someone else
    some time ago, C-41 fixer can be substitued for B&W fixer; and stop bath
    lasts nearly forever. Has anyone tried C-41 developer for black & white
    film? How does it compare to the old standby, Tri-X in D-76? Can Tri-X stand
    the 100F degree temp, and is the 3:15 time long enough, or should it be used
    at a lower temp for a longer time?

    (Yes, I know I could try it myself, but if someone else has already tried
    it, why re-invent the wheel?)
     
    Ken Hart, Aug 11, 2003
    #1
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  2. Ken Hart

    Kammill Guest

    Hi!
    In B&W process - the silver makes the finally picture, in C-41 process
    the silver is replenished from film emulsion (finally picture is made by
    components). So I think that you will have a... clean base instead of
    picture after developing in C-41 developer.

    You can try this on a small part of film...

    And when You want to do not make a new bath for each developing (and
    throw away your money) then you should try an liquid concentrated
    developer like i.e. Ilford LC-29, Ilford Ilfosol S or Agfa Rodinal.

    Kammill
     
    Kammill, Aug 11, 2003
    #2
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  3. Ken Hart

    A Lee Guest

    Why not just use a C41 process B+W film?
    Much easier to do.
    Alan.
     
    A Lee, Aug 11, 2003
    #3
  4. Ken Hart

    Norman Worth Guest

    C-41 is not suitable for processing ordinary black and white film. The blix
    step removes the silver image from the film. The developer has been used
    for extreme compression (very low contrast) with black and white film. When
    used that way, the film is fixed with ordinary fixer. You can use C-41 with
    special chromogenic black and white films like Kodak TMax 400CN and Ilford
    XP2 Plus. Both are excellent films.
     
    Norman Worth, Aug 12, 2003
    #4

  5. No, he won't. The bleach does that. He'll have a negative of some
    sort, the quality of which is questionable.
     
    Michael Scarpitti, Aug 12, 2003
    #5
  6. Ken Hart

    Kammill Guest

    In B&W process - the silver makes the finally picture, in C-41 process
    I think it's depend on kind of developer he using. Some of them washing
    of the whole silver (I saw that), and some of them wont.
    But we agree in one thing - quality is questionable :) probably *very*
    questionable.

    Regards.
    Kammill
     
    Kammill, Aug 12, 2003
    #6
  7. Ken Hart

    Kammill Guest

    And when You want to do not make a new bath for each developing (and
    Sorry but I have no idea :)
    I using only Rodinal (in different dillutions), D76/ID11, and selfmade
    D23 sometimes.
    My life isn't long enough to try every combination of
    developer+dillution+film ;-)

    Regards
    Kammill
     
    Kammill, Aug 12, 2003
    #7
  8. Ken Hart

    Dick Guest

    Hmm, think that is not correct. Last time I accidentally mixed in a Delta
    400 roll with some C-41s that I sent to the lab, it came out as clear as
    could be, useful only for film painting.

    Dick
     
    Dick, Aug 12, 2003
    #8
  9. That's the bleach step.
     
    Michael Scarpitti, Aug 12, 2003
    #9
  10. Ken Hart

    Kammill Guest

    I think it's depend on kind of developer he using. Some of them washing
    But blech bath sometimes is with developer bath. Like in positive color
    process (I don't remeber name).
    I made color prints where was only 3 bath (+ finall wash) -
    developmer+blech, stop bath and fixing bath.
    I cannot say that is one and only possibility - but I saw only one
    example - when the silver B&W film was developed in C-41 developer and
    came out completly clear.
    So - both we have probably right :)

    However - the asker shouldn't do that ;-)

    Kammill
     
    Kammill, Aug 12, 2003
    #10
  11. C-41 developer has been suggested as a low-contrast developer for Technical
    Pan film. I doubt that it would substitute for ordinary developers.

    By all means avoid bleach or blix, of course, which will take the image
    right out of ordinary b&w film.
     
    Michael A. Covington, Aug 12, 2003
    #11
  12. Ken Hart

    Andrew Price Guest

    I only asked because it was you who suggested using LC-29 and
    Ilfosol-S in the first place. I thought you might have known
    something about them.
     
    Andrew Price, Aug 12, 2003
    #12
  13. That was because the film went through the BLEACH step, sometimes
    combined with fixer in something called 'blix'.
     
    Michael Scarpitti, Aug 13, 2003
    #13
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