Did everyone see video artifacts in NBC New Year's show?

Discussion in 'Professional Video Production' started by muzician21, Jan 1, 2009.

  1. muzician21

    muzician21 Guest

    I watched some of the New Year's show on NBC and found it full of
    "swarming bee" artifacts every time there was any panning of the
    camera. I'm watching on a converter box. Was this seen by everyone? I
    didn't notice this with The ABC Dick Clark show.

    I notice various issues with these converter boxes - some broadcasts
    have a harsh, aliased sound, and I often hear a lot of background
    noise artifacts - that sort of "alien static" thing that's
    particularly noticeable when the overall sound levels are lower.

    All of these seem inconsistent, one station displays it, another
    doesn't. I don't know how much of it is the box and how much is the
    broadcast signal itself.
     
    muzician21, Jan 1, 2009
    #1
    1. Advertisements

  2. muzician21

    WQ Guest

    --- Welcome to the brave new annoying world of digital TV.
     
    WQ, Jan 1, 2009
    #2
    1. Advertisements

  3. muzician21

    trotsky Guest


    What?
     
    trotsky, Jan 1, 2009
    #3
  4. muzician21

    RickMerrill Guest

    Your converter box should have a 'menu' option that measures the 'signal
    strength' - what's it say?
     
    RickMerrill, Jan 1, 2009
    #4
  5. muzician21

    brassplyer Guest


    It was a 79-year-old man recovering from a near-fatal stroke. You
    could find yourself in the same predicament tomorrow.

    He's actually improved from his first re-appearance in 2005. That
    first year they didn't come up close on him and he had a lot more
    trouble speaking. He barely moved his hands.

    Obviously it's not like he wants to be like that but apparently
    there's an audience that still wants to see him.
     
    brassplyer, Jan 1, 2009
    #5
  6. muzician21

    muzician21 Guest


    It doesn't seem to have any bearing on the signal strength. The pic is
    either good and strong, various degrees of intermittency with floating
    pieces sort of like a digital mosaic or nothing.

    I've noticed the various audio/video artifacts I first described at
    various points within the "strong enough to have a solid picture"
    signal range.
     
    muzician21, Jan 1, 2009
    #6

  7. It doesn't seem to have any bearing on the signal strength. The pic is
    either good and strong, various degrees of intermittency with floating
    pieces sort of like a digital mosaic or nothing.

    I've noticed the various audio/video artifacts I first described at
    various points within the "strong enough to have a solid picture"
    signal range.

    --The problem we have is that sound gradually breaks up, then
    finally disappears on our downstairs Pace box with some stations
    (no picture problems), but not on the upstairs Scientific Atlanta box.
    Switching briefly to another station, then back, clears the problem
    for a while. Ain't digital TV gran'? 8^)
    --DR
     
    David Ruether, Jan 1, 2009
    #7
  8. muzician21

    David McCall Guest

    There were strict technical specs that defined "broadcast quality".
    The interesting thing was that they only defined things you could
    "read" on a scope. Stuff like Black at 7.5 IRE, Whites not to
    exceed 110 IRE, and a bunch of other stuff that mostly applied to
    timing. They used to reject video that had less than 486 lines of
    "picture" to weed out the amateurs. What the spec never covered
    was what the picture looked like.


    What we've learned is that the content was always king. If you have
    the only video of an airplane crashing into a house they will take it,
    they really won't care that you shot it on your cell phone.

    Now we have U-Tube and other internet sources that don't have to
    meet any criteria for quality. Either people watch it or they don't.

    David
     
    David McCall, Jan 1, 2009
    #8
  9. muzician21

    Guest Guest

    Arny, I've had great respect for you for the last 20 years, and I've
    just lost most of it. Do you know what kind of courage it takes to
    go in front of millions of viewers, almost all of whom remember you
    as a perpetual teenager, after having had a massive stroke?

    I've known Dick Clark since 1979 and he's one of the nicest, most
    down to earth and self-effacing guys I've ever met. Your remark is
    beneath contempt.
     
    Guest, Jan 1, 2009
    #9
  10. muzician21

    Anim8rFSK Guest

    Well, it really never meant anything beyond resolution.
     
    Anim8rFSK, Jan 1, 2009
    #10
  11. muzician21

    Dennis M Guest

    Has anyone noticed a difference in the volume of their local newscast
    recently? I've had to quit watching the local news of my NBC affiliate
    (WSMV Nashville) because the past couple of weeks its audio "booms" so much
    it's really annoying. Unfortunately on my main TV I don't have a feature
    that "equalizes" the sound on all the channels.
     
    Dennis M, Jan 2, 2009
    #11
  12. muzician21

    Anim8rFSK Guest

    The guy in charge of video at FOX animation tried to tell me that we
    didn't need scopes, because, by definition, you couldn't do anything
    illegal with an NTSC signal.

    Instead of firing him, they promoted him to run Uncle Rupert's broadcast
    farm.
     
    Anim8rFSK, Jan 2, 2009
    #12
  13. muzician21

    trotsky Guest


    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.
     
    trotsky, Jan 2, 2009
    #13
  14. muzician21

    muzician21 Guest


    I don't know if it's the box or the signal going into it or somehow
    blamed on both.

    The thing is, some stations are fine, others have ongoing issues. I'm
    not a broadcast tech, it would appear there's some difference between
    what's done with the signal from one station to another, even one
    program to another. Apparently not all stations treat their signal the
    same way.

    Other things I've noticed is on certain rebroadcasts of older shows is
    what I would call compression artifacts, that graininess in the image
    particularly noticeable when there's some area of nondescript
    background - a wall or the like and concurrent with that is what
    sounds like soundtrack bleedthrough from a different show, sort of
    this ghost-like remnant of dialogue you can't quite make out.
     
    muzician21, Jan 2, 2009
    #14
  15. muzician21

    Ty Ford Guest

    Boy Howdy is that right. I have been watching the evolution of HDTV since the
    NAB's first offering in the connecting wing between the Hilton and LVCC.

    We bought a digital Sony receiver just before the Utah winter olympics. NBC
    had a separate DTV programming stream. Completely different from their NTSC
    programming. We were receiving it on a pair of rabbit ears. The video was
    absolutely stunning.

    Just as digital phones have reduced bandwidth to allow more calls, DTV is
    degrading down the same path. It's distributed bandwidth. If a local TV
    station is "broadcasting in HD" on one D channel, using any other of their D
    channels for anything takes away from the bandwidth.

    Even if NO other channels are being used, I was told by an engineer friend at
    a local station that the video compression is 30-40 to one.

    Add to that that HDV (and other compressed digital video) footage is now
    being used and that's what we're being given.

    The video quality my wife and I saw during the Utah olympics, unfortunately,
    will probably never be enjoyed again. If it ain't a crime, it ought to be.

    Regards,

    Ty Ford



    --Audio Equipment Reviews Audio Production Services
    Acting and Voiceover Demos http://www.tyford.com
    Guitar player?:
     
    Ty Ford, Jan 2, 2009
    #15
  16. muzician21

    muzician21 Guest


    That's another thing I've noticed, I'm on the phone all the time and
    during the era when cel phones were switching from analog to digital I
    could usually tell immediately when someone was calling on a digital
    phone - you could hear the muddy modulation and bubbles-in-water
    artifacts.
     
    muzician21, Jan 2, 2009
    #16
  17. muzician21

    Ty Ford Guest

    All I'm saying is that most people will never know how good HDTV looked
    over-the-air at the beginning.

    My tv pliers are now used on the clothes dryer.

    Regards,

    Ty Ford



    --Audio Equipment Reviews Audio Production Services
    Acting and Voiceover Demos http://www.tyford.com
    Guitar player?:
     
    Ty Ford, Jan 3, 2009
    #17
  18. muzician21

    RickMerrill Guest

    Some stations are re-broadcast from satellite signals. Those signals
    usually use Transport MPEG, which contain some error correction, but
    errors still happen!
     
    RickMerrill, Jan 3, 2009
    #18
  19. muzician21

    Anim8rFSK Guest

    And we always kept an old regular set in the corner to show clients what
    it was REALLY going to look like, with a handy VHS hooked up to it, so
    they wouldn't insist on large areas of beautifully oversaturated red
    that were gonna tear apart at home . . .
     
    Anim8rFSK, Jan 3, 2009
    #19
  20. muzician21

    jakdedert Guest

    I used to think the same thing. Now I marvel at the complexity of
    mechanical things like that. Stuff like carburettors that used all
    kinds of mechanical tricks and venturi effects to ensure a proper
    air/fuel mix; old VCR mechanisms that had to be made of machined, cast
    metal with tolerances in the .0001 in order to produce a steady picture;
    typewriters; mechanical adding machines; stepping relays....

    The list goes on and on.

    Dying arts.....

    jak
     
    jakdedert, Jan 3, 2009
    #20
    1. Advertisements

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments (here). After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.