Digital Picture of Britain competition

Discussion in 'UK Photography' started by twhytehot, Sep 8, 2005.

  1. twhytehot

    twhytehot Guest

    Does anyone else share the view that the shortlist for this competition
    (http://www.bbc.co.uk/arts/apictureofbritain/gallery/
    shortlist/index.shtml) is on the whole pretty poor, especially "wales -
    rural" (every shot is rubbish) and "north of england - rural" (a couple
    of decent shots but compared to some of the amazing shots entered into
    that category, incredibly disappointing). Frankly I think it shows
    that you're a hostage to fortune if you let people vote as I strongly
    suspect that many of the poorer shots only got in because the
    photographer and his/her mates voted in large numbers.
     
    twhytehot, Sep 8, 2005
    #1
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  2. That's a bit harsh. I quite like a couple of them. The definition of
    "rural" is being stretched more than a little though and when was a
    Contax 139 ever digital?
    Did you take part? I didn't, so couldn't possibly comment.
     
    Willy Eckerslyke, Sep 8, 2005
    #2
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  3. twhytehot

    Tony Polson Guest


    Nonsense. There are some excellent shots in that category.

    Yes, there are a great many mediocre snaps too, but your analysis
    of the whole is grossly misplaced.
     
    Tony Polson, Sep 8, 2005
    #3
  4. twhytehot

    John Fryatt Guest

    No, I don't share that view. There are a fair number of mediocre shots
    in there but there's some good stuff also.
    I guess that could be true, but why do you suspect it? Any evidence or
    is it just a 'feeling'?
     
    John Fryatt, Sep 8, 2005
    #4
  5. twhytehot

    twhytehot Guest

    i do have some evidence, in that (a) i happened across one photographer
    all of whose 15 or so photos ranked at an average of at least 9.5,
    despite the fact that few of them deserved anything like that (i found
    virtually no other photos with an average that high anywhere else among
    all the amazing photos i clicked on) - clearly they had either
    themselves or though mates given the photo multiple 10/10s; (b) a
    number of times my photos were hit across the board with 1/10 (sad to
    admit i was keeping a tally) - maybe someone genuinely hated all of the
    photos, but i suspect it was someone trying to sabotage the opposition.
    in fact, i was generally very surprised at how low-scoring most of the
    photos i rated highly were - of course maybe my judgment is skewed but
    i believe there was wide-scale nobbling going on. the other reason i
    think many mediocre shots got through is that people didn't bother to
    vote for them, so that the photographers (who, like me, inevitably
    rated their own photos highly) got away with an average skewed too
    high. re my comment about all the welsh rural photos being rubbish, i
    recognise that might be seen as a very harsh comment but it's my view
    and i'm sticking by it.
     
    twhytehot, Sep 8, 2005
    #5
  6. twhytehot

    Tony Polson Guest


    Plonk! Bye ...
     
    Tony Polson, Sep 8, 2005
    #6
  7. twhytehot

    twhytehot Guest

    i should, by the way, clarify that i gave the wrong link - the one i
    gave takes people to ALL the photos entered into each category, you
    have to click on "shortlist" to see the final 13 in each category -
    correct link is:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/arts/apictureofbritain/gallery/shortlist/index.shtml
    not sure if people's replies were based on the former or latter - i
    can well see their point if they looked at the full list. having had
    another look at the shortlist, i can see there are 2 or 3 decent ones
    but still, considering this category received at least 1500 entries
    (probably a lot more), surely you'd have to accept it's a pretty poor
    shortlist
     
    twhytehot, Sep 8, 2005
    #7
  8. It is an odd selection. There are plenty of cracking shots in the
    competition that haven't been shortlisted. However, that's just the
    nature of these things. Talking about "rubbish" and "nobbling" doesn't
    endure you to anyone. If you enter a competition, you should be prepared
    to accept the judges decision and put up with it, even if it is a little
    strange...
     
    Willy Eckerslyke, Sep 8, 2005
    #8
  9. twhytehot

    Stu Carter Guest

    So what you're saying is that your pictures didn't make it?* ;P

    I don't have a huge level of critical skill on photography, but it looks
    like a mixed bag to me - some of them don't look at all bad.


    *mine didn't either.

    Cheers,

    Stu
     
    Stu Carter, Sep 8, 2005
    #9
  10. twhytehot

    Neil Barker Guest

    It's all pretty irrelevant, as no photographer in their right mind
    would agree to the conditions of entry:-


    Where you are invited to submit any contribution to bbc.co.uk
    (including any text, photographs, graphics, video or audio) you agree,
    by submitting your contribution, to grant the BBC a perpetual, royalty-
    free, non-exclusive, sub-licenseable right and license to use,
    reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, create derivative works
    from, distribute, perform, play, make available to the public, and
    exercise all copyright and publicity rights with respect to your
    contribution worldwide and/or to incorporate your contribution in other
    works in any media now known or later developed for the full term of
    any rights that may exist in your contribution, and in accordance with
    privacy restrictions set out in the BBC's Privacy Policy. If you do not
    want to grant to the BBC the rights set out above, please do not submit
    your contribution to bbc.co.uk.


    A major rights-grab, expanding the BBC's picture library (which they
    sell, don't forget) at no cost to themselves.
     
    Neil Barker, Sep 8, 2005
    #10
  11. twhytehot

    Stax Guest

  12. twhytehot

    twhytehot Guest

    "If you enter a competition, you should be prepared to accept the
    judges decision and put up with it, even if it is a little
    strange... "

    My whole point is that this wasn't a decision by a panel of judges
    (we're still waiting for them to decide on the shorlisted photos), it's
    a decision by the voting public. I would say that, like their current
    fortnightly photo comp, the BBC should have reversed it and had the
    judges pick the shortlist then let the public vote on that (ok there's
    a lot of photos for them to judge but it's not an impossible
    challenge). The way they've done it has sold us short in terms of
    quality shortlisted pictures (and I'm not necessarily talking about
    mine: I never expected to be shortlisted but equally I'm frustrated
    that some of mine are, in my view, better than many of the shortlisted
    ones). When they tour the country they will leave a lot of people
    uninspired, which is an opportunity lost. Since this is the first and
    biggest competition of its kind i do think lessons should be learned.
    I'm not attempting to endure (guess you mean endear) myself to anyone
    Willy: in terms of 'nobbling', the competition was easily manipulable
    and i strongly believe it has been. In terms of 'rubbish, there are a
    lot of banal, aesthetically unappealing shots on the shortlist which
    there really shouldn't be given that i believe over 100,000 photos were
    entered. As for Neil's the point about the BBC terms and conditions,
    unless you're a professional why would you care what they do with your
    photos - you still own the copyright at the end of the day. And as for
    Stax - well done mate, what's your secret? (come on admit it, you
    cheated ha ha). Rant over.
     
    twhytehot, Sep 9, 2005
    #12
  13. And my point is that at that stage, the voting public _were_ the judges.
    Hey, it had been a long day...
    The problem is, if you really want people to discuss this rationally
    without everyone concluding that it's merely sour grapes on your part,
    you need to moderate your language. Talking about other photographers'
    work as "rubbish" is not going to get you anywhere.
     
    Willy Eckerslyke, Sep 9, 2005
    #13
  14. twhytehot

    Neil Barker Guest

    I guess that depends on whether you're happy with someone making money
    at your expense and also whether you mind accepting liability from any
    problem arising from the usage of your images.

    I know I wouldn't be, professional or amateur.
     
    Neil Barker, Sep 9, 2005
    #14
  15. Channel 4 ran a vote for the sexiest screen scene a while back. The great
    British public voted for a woman coming out of the sea in a bikini. That in
    their judgment was the *greatest sex scene of all time*!

    Says it all really.

    There is only one thing worse than 'the judges' decision, and that's the
    public's decision. Be your own judge. If a photo pleases you then that image
    is a winner.
     
    no.canned.pork, Sep 9, 2005
    #15
  16. twhytehot

    Phillip Kyle Guest

    That'd be amateur then.

    --
    Phil Kyle™
    Uno
    Dos
    Tres
    Cuatro
    CINCO!!!!!!

    "Be very aware that my willingness
    to continue to criticise your sig
    is infinite." -- Neil Barker
     
    Phillip Kyle, Sep 11, 2005
    #16
  17. twhytehot

    Phillip Kyle Guest

    Miserable git.

    --
    Phil Kyle™
    Uno
    Dos
    Tres
    Cuatro
    CINCO!!!!!!

    "Be very aware that my willingness
    to continue to criticise your sig
    is infinite." -- Neil Barker
     
    Phillip Kyle, Sep 11, 2005
    #17
  18. twhytehot

    twhytehot Guest

    Congratulations Greg/Stax - I see you won the South-West Rural
    category. "The picture captures the mood of the moors and uses an
    interesting, mysterious narrative with the disappearing road" - one of
    the less pretentious bits of gobbledygook from the judges (compared
    with eg "The judges felt that this picture had a very brave narrative,
    a real dialogue" - no, it's an old car in a wood)
     
    twhytehot, Sep 30, 2005
    #18
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