Discussion in 'Professional Video Production' started by Teeafit, Nov 16, 2005.

  1. Teeafit

    Teeafit Guest

    I'm having a worrying problem with a 2-disk DVD project authored on
    Pinnacle Edition Pro v6.10.

    Both disks are very similar, with 2 chapters. They have been authored
    in the same way, with just the chapter content and menu buttons
    differing. Each starts with an 'invisible' menu which contains a
    scrolling copyright warning which must be viewed before the Main Menu
    appears. This Main Menu has 4 buttons, two text and two transparent
    ones relating to an element of the background image - one of each goes
    to each of the chapters. Each chapter returns to this Main Menu.

    Everything played properly in Edition's DVD Preview section, so I
    burned a 'DVD IMAGE 1' to a hard drive. That played well in WinDVD, so
    I used it to burn a DVD-RW. That worked OK in all my test machines, so
    I burned another copy onto DVD-R from the image, and tested it as
    thoroughly as I could. It played well on 3 computers and two DVD
    players, so (after a total of 7 tests) I sent it for glass mastering
    and duplication.

    Today I've received notification from the duplicator that a quality
    control check on the second glass master has showed a menu problem. I'm
    afraid that there will be a similar problem with the first disk, from
    which 1000 copies have already been made.

    I re-checked the original DVD-RW, and it still played without fault on
    5 PCs/players. I then took it to my son's house, and his (Panasonic)
    player did what the duplicator reported - the disk plays fine until the
    Main Menu, at which the menu background picture appears, but none of
    the buttons are superimposed on it. You cannot select a button, but by
    using the 'Skip' control you can jump to the individual chapters
    direct. I've checked the safety backup copies of both disks, and BOTH
    exhibit the same symptoms, so I suspect that 1000 faulty DVDs are on
    their way to me, with the other 1000 'on hold' until I can come up with
    an answer.

    Has anybody experienced this? Is it a bug? Is there a workaround? It's
    possibly too late now for this project (and I shall have to put in some
    kind of "If you have problems, press the Skip button" slip), but I'll
    need to nail this one before the next project comes to duplication
    early in the New Year.

    Teeafit, Nov 16, 2005
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  2. Teeafit

    Steve Guidry Guest

    Unfortunately, this is not an exact science. I see two possible suspects :

    1) You're using a Pinnacle product. I've had numerous bad experiences with
    several of their products. None of them have worked properly.

    2) You're using an RW disc. Sometimes these don't work as well as the
    one-use discs. If you have time, burn the same project out to a one-use
    disc, and see if it passes the replicator's test.

    Steve Guidry, Nov 16, 2005
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  3. Teeafit

    Teeafit Guest

    Thanks, Steve, but the -RW disc bit has already been covered. This was
    only in the early test procedure (to save wasting discs), and the
    actual masters and safety copies were burnt onto -R, both of which
    still play OK on 7 out of 8 machines! As you say, NOT an exact science
    (but a worrying one with a double-DVD aiming to hit the Christmas

    Teeafit, Nov 16, 2005
  4. Teeafit

    Teeafit Guest

    Here's an update:

    Looking on the Pinnacle Users Web Board, I find that this is a known
    problem dating back some 6 months, and affecting mainly Panasonic

    I now have no alternative but to get a thousand of the second disc
    pressed (got to hit the Christmas market!) and print 1000 insert slips
    explaining that if the buttons don't appear, press 'Skip' to access the
    chapters. Very shoddy, and reflecting badly on my business.

    I see the first posting on this thread was 6 months ago, and still no
    sign of a patch from Pinnacle. This is unacceptable, and is seriously
    colouring my thoughts about upgrading to Avid Edition 7.

    Teeafit, Nov 17, 2005
  5. Teeafit

    Pat Horridge Guest

    Your experience is exactly the reason I wouldn't consider doing glass
    mastered replication unless I'd authored on a full spec product.
    We use Scenarist and before that Creator.
    One main advantage being that if that sort of issue every came up (and it
    never has in all the years of using those products) I can contact Sonic and
    get to the bottom of it in a short space of time.
    I suspect contacting Pinnacle won't produce the same result.
    It's the gamble on using a cheaper product. There's always the risk that one
    day it will bite you back. Hopefully the extra profit you've made in the
    past by not having had to purchase a more expensive product and the ongoing
    support that goes with it will cover the loss you'll have to make on the
    1000 duds. Hopefully the next few jobs will go ok and you'll be back in the
    black. But if they don't....

    The only help I could offer would be to look at some of the post authoring
    tools that allow examination and modification of your authored disk. Will be
    an extra cost and it's a new piece of software to learn and know how to use.
    But it will mean you can check future jobs before they go off for
    Pat Horridge, Nov 17, 2005
  6. Teeafit

    Teeafit Guest

    Great, Pat.... but I thought the Pinnacle routine WAS a decent
    authoring program. Maybe naive of me, but when you buy something that
    claims to be at least semi-pro (OK, so LE6 is no FCP or top end Avid,
    but it IS higher than the consumer market) that the various bits will
    at least work OK (or be swiftly dealt with when faults are discovered).

    In the past I've championed LE when others have slagged it off - now
    I'm not so sure.

    Teeafit, Nov 18, 2005
  7. Teeafit

    Steve Guidry Guest

    You are correct to doubt your faith in Pinnacle products. In my book,
    they're dogmeat.

    Steve Guidry, Nov 18, 2005
  8. Teeafit

    Pat Horridge Guest

    Puts a whole new meaning on the importance of "pedigree" maybe some
    manufacturers have different ideas on that.
    But seriously it's all a matter of degree.
    I'm prepared to pay whatever it costs to have a product and support for that
    product and knowledge base for that product in the market I deliver to to be
    as certain as is possible to deliver as perfect an image for duplication as
    I can.
    Fortunatley I have clients that need that sort of assuance and as prepared
    to pay to get it.
    Not all clients will have those budgets the key thing is that they know the
    possible pitfalls with trying to do so much for so little.
    Pat Horridge, Nov 21, 2005
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