Frontier.... bad results???? :-(

Discussion in 'Australia Photography' started by AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 20, 2003.

  1. I new Fuji Frontier lab has opened near me and the test print that I put
    through today was not good, as the images are too dark and the contrast too
    high.

    My system is calibrated and I get great results from a number of pro labs
    using D-Lab, Pegasus and Lamda printers. Plus I can look at my "Carmin"
    test file and print, and WISIWIG

    Have you guys who use a Frontier encounted this problem before? Do other
    Frontier labs ask that special profiles be applied or is this lab just way
    out of wack?
     
    AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 20, 2003
    #1
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  2. I've had pretty good results from frontier labs - I'd suspect the
    problems lies in the "new" part - give them time to sort it all out.
     
    Andrew Hennell, Nov 20, 2003
    #2
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  3. I think so too... but I am ticked that they still charged me $10 for a print
    that is unusable as to them, the problem must be with me. I am the first to
    admit that I can get things wrong, but stacks of well balanced images
    through a variety of prolabs suggest that this could be one of those rare
    times that I am correct. :)

    I am gunna head down there today with the carmen test file and sample print
    and see just how far they are out.... perhaps then I may get a credit for my
    wasted $$ .....not that a credit is any good to unless they fix their
    calibration. :-(
     
    AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 20, 2003
    #3
  4. AU Digital Photo Of The Day

    nt Guest

    Not surprised to hear your having problems with frontier.
    This new machine is a bit hit and miss depending on who's running it. It's
    sad to see such great technology have such a wide gamut of results. I have
    had digi prints ranging from excellent to woeful (depending on the operators
    configuration), and i think they should sort out the contrast issues too.
    Australia is not one place you want to a macine pumping out images of very
    high contrast.


    n.t.
     
    nt, Nov 20, 2003
    #4
  5. AU Digital Photo Of The Day

    Andrew Mc Guest

    Like the other guys, I'd just assume that their Frontier hasn't been calibrated
    as yet. It's always wise to give any new lab a test run with a couple of 4x6's
    (I used to do this in the pre-digital/no profile days, and have carried it on -
    once bitten, twice shy ;) ).
     
    Andrew Mc, Nov 20, 2003
    #5
  6.  
    AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 21, 2003
    #6
  7. OK I just had a look in PS at the image again..... I can duplicate exactly
    their output by applying the sRGB profile. That expains it! :)

    Too bad for those who wish to use wider gamuts such as
    Adobe/Bruce/Colormatch. I wonder if I could charge a consultants fee if
    this fixes their output?? :)
     
    AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 21, 2003
    #7
  8. AU Digital Photo Of The Day

    Bruce Graham Guest

    Do you mean that you supplied say an Adobe98 file and they assigned an
    sRGB profile to it? I think that would do it (but I get confused by this
    stuff).

    I just tried a frontier for the first time and it also came back with
    slightly blown highlights which I don't see in PS on my roughly
    calibrated monitor.

    I used the Frontier for B&W happy snaps of kids, which look a lot nicer
    than those from my Epson 830 which gives nasty casts when attempting a
    B&W print. My standards are probably a lot less demanding than yours,
    but B&W does show up casts pretty clearly and I could not see any on the
    Frontier prints.

    Bruce Graham
     
    Bruce Graham, Nov 21, 2003
    #8
  9. AU Digital Photo Of The Day

    Greg Guest

    It can depend on the operator or operators?
    Some labs will import it into Adobe and may tweak it there, then leave
    it an a queue to be printed. Another operator pulls it off the queue
    and tweaks it as it passes onto the Frontier, and then, it depends on
    how the Frontier is calibrated. Oh, did I mention it also depends on
    what training if any the operator has had, their eye sight, whether
    they are colour blind (yes this does happen believe it or not) and
    whether they are in a hurry or have had a bad day..??

    The Frontier is great, but not faultless unfortunately.

    See if you can get a different operaot to print the sample. You may
    notice a difference.

    Good luck.

    Greg.




     
    Greg, Nov 21, 2003
    #9

  10. Agreed....it sucks big time!

    I dropped back in today and had a look at their system and it uses some
    obscurely named sRGB profile that I am not even sure is a generic one??? As
    you said they cannot use an imbedded profile as they have no way of
    overriding the "satanicRGB" profile..... plus they way they have set things
    up you can't even print direct from PS as it spits it back to the frontier
    box before it hits the processor.

    I got them to open my image in PS using the embedded profile and it looked
    good, plus I then applied the sRGB profile and they agreed that it went to
    crap and looked like my original test result, BUT the silly thing is that I
    "converted" (read converted... not applied) the image to sRGB is photoshop
    and ran it again, yet it still turned out exactly the same???? This I find
    VERY strange, however I have a sneaky suspicion that they may have ran the
    original file by mistake, as he seemed to get a bit lost as to where the
    image was saved and STUPID me did not rename it to something like "PRINT ME
    TEST TWO.jpg"

    The other thing that surprised me was that I caught him converting the image
    to jpg..... naturally I asked "do you always convert to jpg?" and he said
    yes as the Frontier will not recognise a TIFF. .....Huh!!??? So after
    showing him that TIFF can be used I have come to the conclusion that these
    guys need to spend a little bit more time with their machine!! :)
     
    AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 21, 2003
    #10
  11. Back to my comment about "new" equipment :eek:)
     
    Andrew Hennell, Nov 21, 2003
    #11
  12. AU Digital Photo Of The Day

    Lionel Guest

    IIRC, Frontier machines throw away any profile that's been embedded in
    the image. What I do is process in Adobe RGB '98, then soft-proof my
    work in Photoshop, using the Frontier profile. When I drop off the disk,
    I tell the person at the counter to make sure that they disable any
    automatic settings for my prints, & just process them 'as-is'.

    PS: It's worth mentioning that I use a calibrated (Colorvision Spyder)
    monitor & get excellent colour matching with my local digital labs. If
    photography contributes to your income at all, I strongly recommend that
    you use a calibrated monitor - it makes an astounding difference to the
    results.
     
    Lionel, Nov 21, 2003
    #12
  13. I've had a chat with one Frontier lab owner some time ago and he confirmed
    that
    the machine expects images in sRGB and CANNOT NOT use embedded profiles.
    This
    stands to reason, because most consumer digicams spit out jpegs/sRGB. But
    the
    lack of the embedded profile support does suck. :(

    SY,

    -- D.K.
     
    Dmitri Kalintsev, Nov 21, 2003
    #13
  14. AU Digital Photo Of The Day

    MaxM3 Guest

    I just had 12 digital photos printed (6 X 4) at our new Fuji Frontier lab in
    town and I'm impressed.
    I took in a range of indoor, outdoor, day and night shots and really I
    wouldn't bother printing at home again.
    The contrast and colors are perfect.

    BTW they have 3 X 300D in stock.

    Regards,
    Max....
     
    MaxM3, Nov 22, 2003
    #14
  15. Yeah lots of people have good results...

    it really seems to me that they made a mistake when printing my second
    "converted to" sRGB image and printed the original RGB profile again. If I
    have converted the image to sRGB for the second test, there really is no
    reason for it to remain out of wack... otherwise they would only be able to
    print from their own scans (and profile) and not from customer camera cards.

    Having said that, it is all a bit mute now, as I would rather print in a
    wider gamut than use sRGB so Frontier is no longer an option.... which is a
    real pitty as I drive past this place both to and from my son's school each
    day and that would have made them very handy.
     
    AU Digital Photo Of The Day, Nov 22, 2003
    #15
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