It Has Arrived! Kodak Film Made in CHINA!

Discussion in 'Kodak' started by Jeremy, Jul 16, 2005.

  1. Jeremy

    Jeremy Guest

    I was in my warehouse wholesale club today and I picked up an 8-pack of
    KodakGB 200 Negative film (Catalog # 104 5335). Same stuff I've been
    buying for years, but was now about $12.00 for 6 24-exposure rolls plus
    2 36-exposure rolls (total 8 rolls). This stuff used to cost me $16.50.
    I figured that the declining film sales must have made Kodak ger more
    competitive.

    Not exactly . . .

    The box is labelled, "Made in China for Eastman Kodak Company, Rochester
    N.Y. 14650"

    I remember reading that Kodak had purchased the "Lucky Film Company" of
    China a couple of years ago. Well, I guess we are now beginning to see
    the direction that film will be taking. Not that it is any surprise.

    Chinese film rebadged as Kodak product has arrived.
     
    Jeremy, Jul 16, 2005
    #1
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  2. Jeremy

    Joseph Kewfi Guest

    Chinese film rebadged as Kodak product has arrived.

    No you dope, Kodak are using the labour and manufacturing facilities in
    China. It's still Kodak formulation film stock.
     
    Joseph Kewfi, Jul 16, 2005
    #2
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  3. Jeremy

    Gordon Moat Guest

    Fuji recently changed their packaging for many of their films, then tried
    raising the prices, which apparently worked (increased profits). My guess
    is that Kodak saw how successful Fuji was with raising prices, and wanted
    to also get higher profits. I have not seen the latest Kodak SEC report yet
    to see if this strategy worked.

    Several industry analysts (financial, not PMAI), including Gartner Group,
    have stuck with the statement of the latest three years that prices would
    be cut to 1. gain market share, 2. stem losses from conversion to digital,
    and 3. conversion of plants and personnel to lower cost locations. So far,
    those predictions have yet to happen, otherwise film likely would have
    dropped in price. Of course, financial analysts can sometimes be wrong
    about industries, since it is tough to predict the future.
    Lucky Film?
    Actually 40% interest, with a twenty year agreement to continue funding and
    technology exchange (until 2023). The Chinese government rarely allows
    outright purchases by non-Chinese companies, though it could happen in the
    future.
    I am surprised it did not happen sooner. I think in a little way it might
    put Fuji at a slight disadvantage, since there is some Chinese animosity
    towards the Japanese. However, there are other low labour countries than
    China.
    Makes me wonder when the professional transparency films will transition to
    China. It would be curious to see if this will only be consumer films.
     
    Gordon Moat, Jul 16, 2005
    #3
  4. Jeremy

    Jeremy Guest


    It seems all but certain that Kodak will begin producing other--possibly
    all-- film in China. There would be little incentive to restrict
    Chinese production to only a single emulsion.

    The Chinese have demonstrated that they can produce goods to the same
    specs as American-made goods, so the stuff has the potential to be
    exactly the same as was produced in Rochester.

    Still, as an American, I am troubled by so many of our manufacturing
    jobs being sent offshore. But I admit to being pleasantly surprised by
    seeing the price drop by a third.
     
    Jeremy, Jul 17, 2005
    #4
  5. Jeremy

    Mr.Happy Guest

    "an 8-pack of KodakGB 200 Negative film (Catalog # 104 5335). Same
    stuff I've been
    buying for years, but was now about $12.00 for 6 24-exposure rolls plus
    2 36-exposure rolls (total 8 rolls). This stuff used to cost me
    $16.50. "

    so you get 216 shots all together for $12?
    LOL! I beat your price!
    I get 432 shots for $12.(Samsung ISO100-36exp 0.99)
     
    Mr.Happy, Jul 17, 2005
    #5
  6. Jeremy

    Joseph Kewfi Guest

    Still, as an American, I am troubled by so many of our manufacturing
    You can't have it all. Today China is the world's factory, tomorrow's global
    superpower.
     
    Joseph Kewfi, Jul 17, 2005
    #6
  7. Jeremy

    Gordon Moat Guest

    As long as the quality control is there.
    I agree, though will await that judgement until I am able to try it (the films).
    Offshoring is something of limited success, and not for all industries. However,
    I think it was a Minister of Trade in that part of the world who pointed out
    that for companies who choose not to offshore, their competitors might offshore.
    This is a harsh reality of the world today. Witness the success of WalMart, and
    the idea of "buy American" doesn't work too well. There are success stories like
    Harley Davidson, though few similarities in much lower cost items. Even Hyundai
    recently started showing ads to proclaim their $1.5 billion investment in a US
    based factory, employing many workers. It can only happen at a larger scale, or
    with products that cost more. Buying a Hyundai is not "buy American", though it
    would help American workers.

    The other issue in the US is workers laws and environmental laws. The costs of
    those two items make permanent employees and some manufacturing more expensive
    in the US than in some other countries. The US could "clean up" the environment
    simply by forcing companies to leave the US, though that is what is sometimes
    called "economic impact".

    I see no reason that the Chinese should be able to produce film with as reliable
    a quality as what Kodak now produces. I feel bad for all the workers in
    Rochester, New York . . . . . . . . Kodak could have stayed out of China to
    protect US workers, though at some point if it made more economic sense to
    simply shut down the plants, then that would not have helped the workers either,
    merely delayed the inevitable.

    I have lived in the US a while, though I am German. I do not have a compulsion
    to "buy German" to protect German workers. Similar things are happening there
    with offshoring and manufacturing. AGFA Photo is one example, but also look at
    the plight of Leica.
     
    Gordon Moat, Jul 17, 2005
    #7
  8. Jeremy

    Joseph Kewfi Guest

    I get 432 shots for $12.(Samsung ISO100-36exp 0.99)

    I'm getting 36exp. rolls of Fuji Superia 100,200 or 400 iso film for 99p a
    roll, have been doing so since 2003.
     
    Joseph Kewfi, Jul 17, 2005
    #8
  9. Jeremy

    parv Guest

    ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^
    ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^

    Did you mean to write "... no reason that the Chinese should NOT be
    able to ..."?

    - parv
     
    parv, Jul 18, 2005
    #9
  10. Jeremy

    Gordon Moat Guest

    Yes, thanks. Sometimes the typing doesn't come out as well as it should.
     
    Gordon Moat, Jul 18, 2005
    #10
  11. Normally this would worry me a lot, but heck I'd rather be able to buy
    film from China than not at all. If this gets us to 2023 with film on
    the shelves, that will get me nicely to retirement and a bit beyond.
    Hooray. All I ask is to preserve the better films rather than the
    cheaper ones (or both). I think I could live on Tri-X, HIE, Gold (or
    royal gold) and E100S and VS. Maybe we could get Lucky Film to produce
    Tech Pan again.
     
    carbon_dragon, Jul 18, 2005
    #11
  12. Jeremy

    Jeremy Guest

    I sense from several of your posts that you are genuinely concerned that
    film won't be available much longer. While no one can foretell the
    future, I am confident that film will be with us long beyond our lifetimes.

    Film is now a mature product, and it is likely that third world
    countries will produce it, and that it will be of very good quality. I
    don't know about patent issues, but these will eventually expire and I
    would think that would be an incentive for others to produce some of the
    emulsions that we are familiar with.

    Whether there will be much manufacturing of fine quality film cameras is
    something yet to be determined, but right now for every 3 cameras sold,
    one is still a film model.

    Film may well become somewhat of a niche player, but not everyone in
    this world has fast computers and broadband connections. And not every
    person that wants to shoot photos wants to also be proficient on a
    computer. The companies that manufacture and distribute film may change
    over time, but there will still be film--especially 35mm film.
     
    Jeremy, Jul 19, 2005
    #12
  13. From your lips to God's ear.
     
    carbon_dragon, Jul 20, 2005
    #13
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