kodak 125px underexposed (3 stops) while long-time-exposure

Discussion in 'Kodak' started by Hans Koana, Dec 8, 2008.

  1. Hans Koana

    Hans Koana Guest

    hello

    yesterday, in a dark church, where i photographed some dark choir
    stalls, i underexposed a kodak 125px (3 stops). normally i push it to
    get good grey values, which is not so bad because i shooted a roll of
    120-film (6x6). but when i made the photographs i exposed very long time
    so contrast will be enhanced a lot because of the effect of reciprocity.
    i exposed 45 sec instead of 200 sec.

    normally i develop in kodak hc 110 - b, n+0: 6,5 min. n+1: 9 min, n+2
    12,5 min. what do you mean? should i take n+2, loose 2 stops, so that
    zone v falls down at iii, whith a contrast of 3 zones, enforced by this
    long-time-exposure?

    regards h.k.
     
    Hans Koana, Dec 8, 2008
    #1
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  2. Hans Koana

    Hans Koana Guest

    Richard Knoppow schrieb:

    > First of all using a developer like Xtol, T-Max or
    > T-Max RS, DDX, or Microphen will gain a bit of speed over
    > HC-110, perhaps 3/4 stop. Increasing development time to
    > "push" film just increases the contrast. Where the exposure
    > is mostly on the toe, which has lower contrast than the rest
    > of the film curve, the increase will make this low contrast
    > image more easily printable but will result in very high
    > contrast for anything which has received more exposure. Your
    > exposure error is around two stops. If its based on the
    > normal film speed you can probably pull out printable
    > negatives but forget the zone system because the tone
    > rendition will be a bit distorted by the reciprocity failure
    > plus you are getting very near the limit of exposure which
    > will register on the film. Again, I suggest using a
    > different type of developer for this roll and trying to push
    > a couple of stops. Plus-X responds fairly well to pushing.


    Thank you very much, i will try it soon. But I think I have got to
    revisit this little church in Romont / Switzerland again to take
    photographs of the choir. Thank you again.

    Regards H.K.
     
    Hans Koana, Dec 8, 2008
    #2
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  3. On 12/8/2008 7:24 AM Hans Koana spake thus:

    > yesterday, in a dark church, where i photographed some dark choir
    > stalls, i underexposed a kodak 125px (3 stops). normally i push it to
    > get good grey values, which is not so bad because i shooted a roll of


    That would be "I shot a roll" in English.

    > 120-film (6x6). but when i made the photographs i exposed very long time
    > so contrast will be enhanced a lot because of the effect of reciprocity.
    > i exposed 45 sec instead of 200 sec.
    >
    > normally i develop in kodak hc 110 - b, n+0: 6,5 min. n+1: 9 min, n+2
    > 12,5 min. what do you mean? should i take n+2, loose 2 stops, so that
    > zone v falls down at iii, whith a contrast of 3 zones, enforced by this
    > long-time-exposure?


    Seems to me that's all you *can* do; otherwise, you're going to
    completely lose whatever shadow detail you have, or get a low-contrast,
    difficult-to-print negative.


    --
    Washing one's hands of the conflict between the powerful and the
    powerless means to side with the powerful, not to be neutral.

    - Paulo Freire
     
    David Nebenzahl, Dec 8, 2008
    #3
  4. Hans Koana

    Hans Koana Guest

    David Nebenzahl schrieb:
    > On 12/8/2008 7:24 AM Hans Koana spake thus:
    >
    >> yesterday, in a dark church, where i photographed some dark choir
    >> stalls, i underexposed a kodak 125px (3 stops). normally i push it to
    >> get good grey values, which is not so bad because i shooted a roll of

    >
    > That would be "I shot a roll" in English.
    >
    >> 120-film (6x6). but when i made the photographs i exposed very long time
    >> so contrast will be enhanced a lot because of the effect of reciprocity.
    >> i exposed 45 sec instead of 200 sec.
    >>
    >> normally i develop in kodak hc 110 - b, n+0: 6,5 min. n+1: 9 min, n+2
    >> 12,5 min. what do you mean? should i take n+2, loose 2 stops, so that
    >> zone v falls down at iii, whith a contrast of 3 zones, enforced by this
    >> long-time-exposure?

    >
    > Seems to me that's all you *can* do; otherwise, you're going to
    > completely lose whatever shadow detail you have, or get a low-contrast,
    > difficult-to-print negative.



    I do not know wether this development (N+2) would be wrong because the
    scene is very dark, with wooden figures that come out of the dark
    background. I Will try it again. Thank you. Regards H.K.
     
    Hans Koana, Dec 8, 2008
    #4
  5. "Hans Koana" <> wrote in message
    news:ghjplf$2id$...
    > David Nebenzahl schrieb:
    >> On 12/8/2008 7:24 AM Hans Koana spake thus:
    >>
    >>> yesterday, in a dark church, where i photographed some dark choir
    >>> stalls, i underexposed a kodak 125px (3 stops). normally i push it to
    >>> get good grey values, which is not so bad because i shooted a roll of

    >>
    >> That would be "I shot a roll" in English.
    >>
    >>> 120-film (6x6). but when i made the photographs i exposed very long time
    >>> so contrast will be enhanced a lot because of the effect of reciprocity.
    >>> i exposed 45 sec instead of 200 sec.
    >>>
    >>> normally i develop in kodak hc 110 - b, n+0: 6,5 min. n+1: 9 min, n+2
    >>> 12,5 min. what do you mean? should i take n+2, loose 2 stops, so that
    >>> zone v falls down at iii, whith a contrast of 3 zones, enforced by this
    >>> long-time-exposure?

    >>
    >> Seems to me that's all you *can* do; otherwise, you're going to
    >> completely lose whatever shadow detail you have, or get a low-contrast,
    >> difficult-to-print negative.

    >
    > I do not know wether this development (N+2) would be wrong because the
    > scene is very dark, with wooden figures that come out of the dark
    > background. I Will try it again. Thank you. Regards H.K.
    >

    If you are in fact able to try it again, I strongly suggest that you
    bracket. If your base exposure is 200 sec (over 3 minutes!), try in
    addition to 200 sec exposures of 400 sec and 800 sec.
     
    Lawrence Akutagawa, Dec 8, 2008
    #5
  6. Hans Koana

    Hans Koana Guest

    Lawrence Akutagawa schrieb:
    > "Hans Koana" <> wrote in message
    > news:ghjplf$2id$...
    >> David Nebenzahl schrieb:
    >>> On 12/8/2008 7:24 AM Hans Koana spake thus:
    >>>
    >>>> yesterday, in a dark church, where i photographed some dark choir
    >>>> stalls, i underexposed a kodak 125px (3 stops). normally i push it to
    >>>> get good grey values, which is not so bad because i shooted a roll of
    >>> That would be "I shot a roll" in English.
    >>>
    >>>> 120-film (6x6). but when i made the photographs i exposed very long time
    >>>> so contrast will be enhanced a lot because of the effect of reciprocity.
    >>>> i exposed 45 sec instead of 200 sec.
    >>>>
    >>>> normally i develop in kodak hc 110 - b, n+0: 6,5 min. n+1: 9 min, n+2
    >>>> 12,5 min. what do you mean? should i take n+2, loose 2 stops, so that
    >>>> zone v falls down at iii, whith a contrast of 3 zones, enforced by this
    >>>> long-time-exposure?
    >>> Seems to me that's all you *can* do; otherwise, you're going to
    >>> completely lose whatever shadow detail you have, or get a low-contrast,
    >>> difficult-to-print negative.

    >> I do not know wether this development (N+2) would be wrong because the
    >> scene is very dark, with wooden figures that come out of the dark
    >> background. I Will try it again. Thank you. Regards H.K.
    >>

    > If you are in fact able to try it again, I strongly suggest that you
    > bracket. If your base exposure is 200 sec (over 3 minutes!), try in
    > addition to 200 sec exposures of 400 sec and 800 sec.


    Hello,

    I have got to take the train from Bern to Romont (50km). The calculated
    exposure time as indicated on my Gossen Lunasix F is t=30sec (c.e.),
    f=11, ASA 125, with incident light metering. Following the instructions
    by Kodak, I need t=200sec (a.e.) as the adjusted exposure time. And I
    have got to adjust the development -30%, what means N-1, to avoid
    lighter zones that are too contrasty.

    But you're right: it is better to bracket than loosing an exposure. For
    this reason I will bracket and try an additional exposure time of
    t=60sec (c.e.) / t=550sec (a.e.) (one stop). This is nearly in the
    middle of your two suggestions. The contrast of the scene is not so wide
    (about 4 zones max.), and this is why 1/3 stop of under- or overexposure
    is not so difficult to manage.

    Regards H.K.
     
    Hans Koana, Dec 9, 2008
    #6
  7. "Hans Koana" <> wrote in message
    news:ghlq90$8ev$...
    > Lawrence Akutagawa schrieb:
    >> "Hans Koana" <> wrote in message
    >> news:ghjplf$2id$...
    >>> David Nebenzahl schrieb:
    >>>> On 12/8/2008 7:24 AM Hans Koana spake thus:
    >>>>
    >>>>> yesterday, in a dark church, where i photographed some dark choir
    >>>>> stalls, i underexposed a kodak 125px (3 stops). normally i push it to
    >>>>> get good grey values, which is not so bad because i shooted a roll of
    >>>> That would be "I shot a roll" in English.
    >>>>
    >>>>> 120-film (6x6). but when i made the photographs i exposed very long
    >>>>> time
    >>>>> so contrast will be enhanced a lot because of the effect of
    >>>>> reciprocity.
    >>>>> i exposed 45 sec instead of 200 sec.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> normally i develop in kodak hc 110 - b, n+0: 6,5 min. n+1: 9 min, n+2
    >>>>> 12,5 min. what do you mean? should i take n+2, loose 2 stops, so that
    >>>>> zone v falls down at iii, whith a contrast of 3 zones, enforced by
    >>>>> this
    >>>>> long-time-exposure?
    >>>> Seems to me that's all you *can* do; otherwise, you're going to
    >>>> completely lose whatever shadow detail you have, or get a low-contrast,
    >>>> difficult-to-print negative.
    >>> I do not know wether this development (N+2) would be wrong because the
    >>> scene is very dark, with wooden figures that come out of the dark
    >>> background. I Will try it again. Thank you. Regards H.K.
    >>>

    >> If you are in fact able to try it again, I strongly suggest that you
    >> bracket. If your base exposure is 200 sec (over 3 minutes!), try in
    >> addition to 200 sec exposures of 400 sec and 800 sec.

    >
    > Hello,
    >
    > I have got to take the train from Bern to Romont (50km). The calculated
    > exposure time as indicated on my Gossen Lunasix F is t=30sec (c.e.),
    > f=11, ASA 125, with incident light metering. Following the instructions
    > by Kodak, I need t=200sec (a.e.) as the adjusted exposure time. And I
    > have got to adjust the development -30%, what means N-1, to avoid
    > lighter zones that are too contrasty.
    >
    > But you're right: it is better to bracket than loosing an exposure. For
    > this reason I will bracket and try an additional exposure time of
    > t=60sec (c.e.) / t=550sec (a.e.) (one stop). This is nearly in the
    > middle of your two suggestions. The contrast of the scene is not so wide
    > (about 4 zones max.), and this is why 1/3 stop of under- or overexposure
    > is not so difficult to manage.
    >

    For what it is worth, here's another idea -

    I surmise you are shooting 120 6x6. Bracket the first four exposures
    however you want. Place the lens cap back on the camera and shoot the next
    four frames. Take the lens cap off and bracket the last four exposures
    exactly as you did the first. In the darkroom, carefully remove the paper
    backing of the film and cut the film in half so you have four exposures in
    each half. Placing the second half in a light tight place, load the first
    half in the developing tank and develop as you see fit. Examine the
    developed and fixed first half. If you are satisfied, fine. If you are
    not, you then have a benchmark against which you can now develop the second
    half.
     
    Lawrence Akutagawa, Dec 9, 2008
    #7
  8. In article <ghlq90$8ev$>,
    Hans Koana <> wrote:
    >
    >I have got to take the train from Bern to Romont (50km). The calculated
    >exposure time as indicated on my Gossen Lunasix F is t=30sec (c.e.),
    >f=11, ASA 125, with incident light metering. Following the instructions
    >by Kodak, I need t=200sec (a.e.) as the adjusted exposure time. And I
    >have got to adjust the development -30%, what means N-1, to avoid
    >lighter zones that are too contrasty.


    Don't use Plus-X! The reciprocity behavior of modern Kodak films is
    much, much better, which also means that less development adjustment
    will be required.

    --
    Thor Lancelot Simon
    "Even experienced UNIX users occasionally enter rm *.* at the UNIX
    prompt only to realize too late that they have removed the wrong
    segment of the directory structure." - Microsoft WSS whitepaper
     
    Thor Lancelot Simon, Dec 9, 2008
    #8
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