MiniDV camcorder full frame uncompressed capture (rookie)

Discussion in 'Professional Video Production' started by Atlas, Aug 30, 2003.

  1. Atlas

    Atlas Guest

    I'm tring to capture a video from a Sony TRV8E MiniDV camcorder, connect to
    an Adaptec DuoConnect 1394 port under Windows XP, P3 1GHz, 500MB RAM.

    I've tried with Windows MovieMaker 5.1 and Adobe Premiere 6.0 trial.

    Both programs can capture but it looks like only at preselected formats.
    Problem is that even at higest quality DV-PAL, 25Mbps, 720 x 576, 25 FPS the
    captured video looks poor.

    What I would like to do is capture the video say creating a full frame
    uncompressed AVI, later on choosing whatever encoder to compress the video.

    Is that possible? If not what utility would you suggest (freeware?Tried
    VirtualDub, it fails).
    If not what is the best capturing quality?

    Thanks
     
    Atlas, Aug 30, 2003
    #1
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  2. Atlas

    Alan Lloyd Guest

    That is correct.
    How does the video look when it it played directly out of the
    camcorder to a known good monitor?
    It is possible to do uncompressed capture, but not for free. The main
    cost for that is hardware - as in big, fast disks striped in an array,
    generally connected by specialized hardware to a 601 (SDI) or
    component analog source. Any 1394 transfer from a camcorder is by its
    nature compressed 5:1 in the recording process.
    HD - multiply the above "uncompressed" description by about six.
    Sadly, also not freely or een cheaply available.
     
    Alan Lloyd, Aug 30, 2003
    #2
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  3. Atlas

    Atlas Guest

    Played on TV looks superb.
    Actually captured @ 25Mbps seems good quality but plays badly, as if the
    moviemaker software grasps triyng not to drop frames. Also "funny" stripes
    arise when zooming the playback of the captured AVI/DV-PAL file.
    When saving to final movie file , quality degrades.
    Must be somewhere a software that reads the AVI/DV-PAL file and encodes to
    something excellent quality say divx.......or uncompressed.....
    Tell me exactly how the so called AVI/DV-PAL file works...You mean that from
    the camcorder to the PC through firewire quality degrades by 5:1??????
    Argh.......!!!!!!!!

    So what if I want to move my MiniDV library to DVD???? Rubbish???
     
    Atlas, Aug 30, 2003
    #3
  4. *BY DEFINITION* the formats: DV, DVCAM, DVCpro25 are all
    compressed 5x. Always. NTSC or PAL.
    Something else is wrong with your setup. DV can look VERY
    good. The output quality should be identical to the input
    quality (because it is digital.)

    If you could afford uncompressed digital video equipment,
    you likely wouldn't be asking questions here! :)
     
    Richard Crowley, Aug 31, 2003
    #4
  5. Atlas

    Atlas Guest

    Is there any primer on the web for an introduction on the miniDV format, and
    the basic and advanced processes of capturing, converting and encoding
    movies???


    Thanks.
     
    Atlas, Aug 31, 2003
    #5
  6. Atlas

    David Winter Guest

    Atlas

    HTH

    Make sure your hard disk for video has DMA enabled.

    Post your system details and folks here will give you directions on how to
    enable DMA.

    This will solve your problem - it's called dropped frames.

    DW


    : Is there any primer on the web for an introduction on the miniDV format,
    and
    : the basic and advanced processes of capturing, converting and encoding
    : movies???
    :
    :
    : Thanks.
    :
    :
    : : > "Atlas" wrote ...
    : > > Tell me exactly how the so called AVI/DV-PAL file works...
    : > > You mean that from the camcorder to the PC through firewire
    : > > quality degrades by 5:1??????
    : >
    : > *BY DEFINITION* the formats: DV, DVCAM, DVCpro25 are all
    : > compressed 5x. Always. NTSC or PAL.
    : >
    : > > Argh.......!!!!!!!!
    : > > So what if I want to move my MiniDV library to DVD????
    : > > Rubbish???


    It will look great, properly encoded, and with well though out menus. See
    above for getting the data onto hard disk properly.

    :)

    DW



    : >
    : > Something else is wrong with your setup. DV can look VERY
    : > good. The output quality should be identical to the input
    : > quality (because it is digital.)
    : >
    : > If you could afford uncompressed digital video equipment,
    : > you likely wouldn't be asking questions here! :)
    : >
    : >
    :
    :
     
    David Winter, Aug 31, 2003
    #6
  7. Atlas

    nappy Guest

    ONe thing to remember about DV.. The signal chain requires almost zero
    attention. You plug it in and capture with a DV codec. All they do is
    transfer data from the camera. There is no processing at all. Moving data..
    That is all there is. Same on output unless you need rendering which will be
    only one generation away from the original. In DV, this is the only real
    place the codec comes in. If it is a good codec you should be able to
    compose a few generations without noticeable degredation. If you are seeing
    a radical difference between your camera output and your editor's output
    then you are inject another codec or frame size difference in your
    render-encode step.

    DV is an excellent format to use as source for DVD.
     
    nappy, Aug 31, 2003
    #7
  8. Atlas

    Atlas Guest

    Ahhhhhhh!!!! Stupid me!!!!, I've got it.
    After testing multiple players I think the problem was that the first
    players I've tried were showing also the scanline artifacts from the
    interleaved video.......
    That occurred when saving at the maximum quality DV->1394->DV-AVI and
    showing frame by frame (example in virtualdub). Applying thedeinterlace
    filter in a frame by frame or playing full motion shows perfect!!!!!!

    By the way is the DVD video quality (Mpeg2 ???) higher then
    DV(-AVI-PAL)????????

    Bye
     
    Atlas, Sep 3, 2003
    #8
  9. Atlas

    thrillcat Guest

    Tell me exactly how the so called AVI/DV-PAL file works...You mean that
    from

    It's not between the camcorder and the PC, it's between the lens and the
    tape.
     
    thrillcat, Sep 3, 2003
    #9
  10. Atlas

    Atlas Guest

    Ok I'm studing and getting more into it.

    The defect I was referring to is "Saw tooth type edge distortion".
    Exactly.......

    Looking for a progressive scan Camcorder :))))????????
     
    Atlas, Sep 4, 2003
    #10
  11. Atlas

    thrillcat Guest

    Have you burned a DVD yet? That probably won't be visible on a TV. TV's
    and computer monitors have different pixel aspect ratios, which cause alot
    of the "saw tooth type edge distortion" you're getting.

    Burn a DVD, play it on your TV. See if it's still there.
     
    thrillcat, Sep 5, 2003
    #11
  12. Atlas

    RGBaker Guest

    Have you burned a DVD yet? That probably won't be visible on a TV. TV's
    The pixel aspect ratio is not the cause of this issue (though it is a novel
    thought!) -- the 'problem' is that TV is actually two fields displayed
    sequentially to create a single frame, and their is a time delay between the
    fields so a moving object is not in the same place for the second field --
    computer monitors take both fields and display them at the same time,
    ignorant of the time delay between the fields & so causing a visible blur or
    jagged edge on moving objects. Note that the moving object might be the
    camcorder, so that even static objects in the frame will exhibit this moving
    object artifact.

    That said, the poster is quite right in suggesting that sending the signal
    back to a TV will reveal if this is the source of the trouble.

    GB
     
    RGBaker, Sep 5, 2003
    #12
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