Nikon is in EXCELLENT position.....

Discussion in 'Nikon' started by JR, Nov 2, 2005.

  1. JR

    JR Guest

    Just thinking about things. I just bought a D2X and seriously thought
    about moving to Canon. The D2X is an amazing camera and now the D200 is
    coming out in 6 weeks and WOW again. They have come up with a real
    contender for the 5D...Half the price and all the bells and whistles.
    So they have an entry level camera the D50, a mid level, in the D70s, an
    advanced amateur in the D200, and the 2 pro bodies the D2x and D2Hs. It
    also seems that Sony has begun to catch up with Canon with sensor
    development, so they will begin to release quicker and actually innovate
    as well. This is going to be the case because Sony is actually using
    the same sensors in their digicam. So they will develop more APS sized
    sensors. All the while Nikon is preparing the LBCAST III sensor that
    will have better noise, and resolution than current senosrs on the
    market. These will go in the D3 series of cameras. The future looks
    very good on the Nikon side. I predict the D70s will be disconitued in
    months, like march and the D80 will be released with the same 10
    megapixel sensor and the D70s body and feature set. Way to go
    Nikon....This makes life great for everyone. This is good for Nikon
    users, having great bodies to use that great glass on, and for Canon
    users, it pushes their hand to make their bodies better to leap frog
    Nikon. This is bad for Olympus, Pentax, Minolta......I dont think they
    can keep up.

    JR
     
    JR, Nov 2, 2005
    #1
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  2. JR

    223rem Guest

    but not the main thing: the 35 mm sensor, which I bet Canon will use
    in their upcoming pro body. Nikon will have no answer to that.
    I agree. But Canon dwarfs Nikon. Canon is the Microsoft of digital
    cameras.
     
    223rem, Nov 2, 2005
    #2
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  3. JR

    JR Guest

    And no pro sports shooters will have one. DX sized sensors saves sports
    shooters LOTS of money and with the high speed cropping it makes your
    camera bag much lighter. At a major auto race, I saw 3 times as many
    Nikon D2X's to 1DS's....But seriously, a D2X with a 70-200/2.8 will be
    the same as a 400/2.8 on a FF Canon. How much is a Canon 400/2.8?
    Probably as much or more than the D2X itself. Do any of them care one
    bit its not a FF sensor? NO. Do i? NO. Do my clients? NO. Will I
    make more money, or better pictures with a FF vs. a DX sensor? NO. All
    the reviews are out and the DX sized D2X has comparable image quality to
    the 1DSmkIIN...at 4 MP LESS....Oh and will you buy MORE expensive glass
    to help with your edge sharpness and light falloff. And what will you
    do with the chromatic aberration? When someone can put 2 images in
    front of me and say image A was taken with a FF sensor and image B was
    taken with a DX, and all else was equal and image A is superior...then
    I'll buy your argument. NO ONE CAN AT THIS POINT because the DX sensor
    in the D2X is as good or BETTER than the FF sensors currently on the
    market.

    JR
     
    JR, Nov 2, 2005
    #3
  4. JR

    tlai909 Guest

    Yes but I bet people who like wide angle photography think the FF
    sensor in the 5D is a boon.

    Highlighting ONE positive aspect of APS sized sensors to suit your
    argument will fool only people of like minds.

    T.
     
    tlai909, Nov 2, 2005
    #4
  5. JR

    DD Guest

    I disagree on the discontinuing of the D70s. Nikon usually stand behind
    their SLR's for a while longer than Canon does. The D100 has been around
    for over three years!

    What will happen is we will probably see a drop in the price of both the
    D70s and D50. I guess the cheapest might come down to under $500.
     
    DD, Nov 2, 2005
    #5
  6. JR

    Jeremy Nixon Guest

    Not everyone cares. Indeed, the 5D's "main thing" being the 35mm sensor
    makes that camera pretty darned uninteresting indeed, except as a harbinger
    of things to come.
     
    Jeremy Nixon, Nov 2, 2005
    #6
  7. JR

    JR Guest


    Sorry but you can get a 12-24mm lens for the DX and thats wide enough
    for 99% of the photogs out there. Its funny that when the 18mm was
    about as wide as you could get for 35mm, no one complained about it not
    being wide enough, now a DX with a 12mm lens isnt "wide enough"...

    Sorry, I looked into the 5D and the poor build quality, soft corners,
    color fringing, chromatic aberration, and an arm and a leg for long
    lenses made the DX format the best for me. Ignoring the shortcomings of
    a camera just because the "hype" says its better in theory is ignorant
    and small minded. Dont believe me, do the research the 5D output has
    distinct flaws and compared to the D2X, is inferior. Even with wide
    angles.

    JR
     
    JR, Nov 2, 2005
    #7
  8. JR

    JR Guest

    No, the D70 line will end in about a 2 year cycle which will be this
    spring. This will be the normal camera life for a while 2 years. The
    D50 will stay that way for awhile the D70 is getting long in the tooth,
    and when Canon announces the 20D upgrade/replacement, Nikon will have to
    upgrade this camera accordingly,

    D50-Rebel XT
    D70s-20D
    D200-5D
    D2X/D2H-1DsII


    JR
     
    JR, Nov 2, 2005
    #8
  9. You can say that till Canon releases the upgrade to the Canon 20D ;-)

    - Siddhartha
     
    Siddhartha Jain, Nov 2, 2005
    #9
  10. It's not a question. It's a way for Canon users to bleed money.
     
    David Dyer-Bennet, Nov 2, 2005
    #10
  11. The problem with this eminently logical and reasonable post is that
    the Sports Illustrated photo team for their first digital Superbowl
    was nearly all Canon. So it doesn't seem like your argument passes
    the reality check.
     
    David Dyer-Bennet, Nov 2, 2005
    #11
  12. I though that the first 'digital Superbowl' was done before the D2X was
    on the market. Did they consider the D2X and rejected it in favor of the
    Canon?

    With long lenses, it quite possible that a 1Ds plus lens is twice as
    expensive as a D2X with matching lens. That's quite a bit of momey you have
    to recover by selling higher quality images at a premium.
     
    Philip Homburg, Nov 2, 2005
    #12
  13. If you add the price of a 5D and that of a F6 then you get the theoretical
    price a full frame 'D3' would cost if Nikon can produce full frame sensors
    at the same price as Canon.

    My guess is that at price, the full frame camera would be in instant hit.

    On the other hand, Nikon's strategy with the D200 is quite interesting.
    According to the specs, the D200 is almost a professional body at about
    the same price as Nikon's professional film body, the F6.

    If the D200 is 'professional' enough, then Canon will probably try match that
    with a 30D that has both a higher resolution sensor (what happens when
    Canon does 12 Mpixel at 1.6x crop) and a better spec body.

    The resulting huge gap between that 30D and the 1Ds requires either a much
    lower price for the 1Ds or a much higher resolution (20 Mpixels, maybe more)

    The important thing about the 5D is that Canon showed that full frame sensors
    don't have to be extremely expensive.
     
    Philip Homburg, Nov 2, 2005
    #13
  14. Spec to spec, is that a fair comparison?
    the XT is 8MP vs the D50's 6MP and the XT's electronics are far
    superior. IMHO, except for the size, the XT competes with the D70s and
    not D50. The D50 probably competes with the 300D (still in
    production?).
    Again, I am sure the D200 is a fine camera as all Nikon dSLRs are but I
    would think that someone who needs a FF dSLR needs one. Canon seems to
    have brought the 5D to compete with the D2X.
    Well, if I were considering buying a 1Ds-MkII would I also consider the
    Nikon D2X/D2H? I guess not because I probably already have a bagful of
    Canon lens and I need that FF sensor.

    The *competing* Nikon/Canon models look more like completing products
    to me.

    - Siddhartha
     
    Siddhartha Jain, Nov 2, 2005
    #14
  15. JR

    DD Guest

    The more "kneejerk" reactions to Nikon products that Canon have, the
    more they will harm themselves in the long run.

    Fewer products with better quality and the RIGHT specifications are what
    the market needs. Not just a 30D to compete against the D200. Hype will
    eventually be found out for what it is.

    Nikon have played an ace by allowing the D200 to meter using manual
    focus lenses. That makes it very hard to beat because now suddenly the
    Nikon system becomes VERY attractive given the plethora of excellent MF
    lenses available on the used market. It will even allow you to get
    colour matrix metering with most of them, as well as allow you to use
    AI-modified lenses.
     
    DD, Nov 2, 2005
    #15
  16. 14mm was just beginning to get really wide, for me. My Sigma 14mm (one
    of my few dalliances with Sigma) does not work on Canon DSLRs :-(

    ....and would not have been particularly wide if it did.

    David
     
    David Littlewood, Nov 2, 2005
    #16
  17. JR

    Scott W Guest

    I do think Nikon is finally getting into gear, about time.
    I would really hate to see any one company be too dominate, we really
    don't need a Microsoft of the DSLR world.
     
    Scott W, Nov 2, 2005
    #17
  18. Well, isn't the 12mm on the APS-C sensor about as wide as the 18mm on a
    35mm? So, it follows that if it isn't wide enough for one, it isn't
    wide enough for the other.

    Now, it starts to get problematic to get an even shorter focal length on
    the lenses because the glass gets so close to the sensor that the
    shutter is affected.
     
    Thomas T. Veldhouse, Nov 2, 2005
    #18
  19. try RSE.

    it has the ability to change the contrast,
    in the highlights,
    and in the shadows.

    it will help with your problem.
     
    bob crownfield, Nov 2, 2005
    #19
  20. JR

    Skip M Guest

    Again, you're right about one thing, and wrong about another. Most of the
    sportshooters who use Canon don't use the 1Ds, that would be silly. FF and
    4fps wouldn't work. They use the 1D mkII, 1.3x crop and 8fps, 8mp. So,
    it's no surprise that D2x bodies outnumbered 1Ds bodies, I wonder about 1D
    bodies, though...
    At the Thunderboat Regatta, I didn't see a single Nikon with a tele
    attached, I did see some guys with Nikons, but they didn't have that
    harried, haggard, overworked and overloaded look that most PJs have. By the
    way, there were several there with 1D mkIIs and 400mm f2.8 Canons...
     
    Skip M, Nov 2, 2005
    #20
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