Olympus refurbished BEWARE

Discussion in 'Olympus' started by David James, Jun 1, 2004.

  1. David James

    David James Guest

    Before you buy an Olympus refurbished camera please check the page below.
    This is how the camera was boxed, I have not used it.

    David James, Jun 1, 2004
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  2. You may be blaming the wrong party. What do you know about the seller? Is
    he an authorized Olympus dealer?

    I've bought refurbished stuff, including an Oly camera, with no problem.
    But I always bought from a reputable dealer. I don't buy on ebay because I
    need to know who I buy from, whether it is online, by phone, or in a store.
    I may miss great prices by avoiding ebay, but I have less worry.
    Marvin Margoshes, Jun 1, 2004
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  3. David James

    ejb Guest

    I bought an Oly E20p refurb from an Oly dealer.
    The camera,box,manuals,CDs were indistinguishable from new stuff.
    I wouldn't hesitate to buy an Oly refurb again,in the future,as long as it
    was from an official dealer.
    ejb, Jun 1, 2004
  4. David James

    D.R. Guest

    Could it be the the seller bought a refurbished camera
    for personal use, got it trashed somehow then flicked
    it off on eBay?
    D.R., Jun 1, 2004

  5. From the web page above...

    Get real, David. You got ripped off by an eBay seller - a seller with 121
    neutral and 172 negative feedback comments in the last 12 months, many
    talking about "misleading representation," "false advertising," a "different
    camera than pictured," "defective" items, items with "scratches," and items
    with "deep scratches." Here is the auction page you listed on the eBay


    I cannot believe Olympus, a company with an outstanding reputation over
    many years, would ever send out a camera like that as a refurbished model.
    Based on the pictures, I suspect the seller got a refurbished camera from
    Olympus and then put a junk camera in the box to sale on eBay. You only have
    that sellers word this particular camera was the one in that box. Heck, for
    all we know, you may have photographed another camera next to the box of the
    camera you received from that seller.

    Regardless, you didn't buy the camera from Olympus or an authorized
    dealer, so they're not responsible in any way. You also didn't buy the
    camera from the Olympus website, so the disclaimer on that website has
    nothing to do with any of this. Therefore, you never should have even
    mentioned Olympus, nor should you have posted warnings to "beware" of buying
    refurbished cameras from Olympus on your web page, the eBay forum listed on
    your web page, this newsgroup, and perhaps elsewhere. In my opinion, by
    directly linking Olympus to a failed eBay auction in such a way as to
    suggest they're somehow responsible, especially in such a public manner,
    you're seriously risking a libel lawsuit from the company.

    Dwight Stewart

    Dwight Stewart, Jun 2, 2004
  6. David James

    David James Guest

    I have updated the page and explained a few more things taking some of the
    heat off Olympus.
    David James, Jun 2, 2004
  7. David James

    Mike Kohary Guest

    What a misleading post. Don't you mean, "Ebay BEWARE"? And don't you mean,
    "Before you buy a piece of electronic equipment off of Ebay..."?

    It has nothing to do with Olympus, or the camera being refurbished.

    Mike Kohary, Jun 2, 2004
  8. David James

    Zebedee Guest

    It strikes me that EBay is a place to avoid when buying anything. I've seen
    so much dodgy stuff on sale there that it seems more like a fence's
    paradise. When I was managing a charity shop, I had three people coming in
    to work off their community service sentences which they had been given for
    selling stolen goods via ebay.

    It would reduce the proceeds of crime and also quite likely funding for
    terrorists if ebay was simply closed down permanantly.



    (Claiming asylum in an attempt
    to escape paying his debts to
    Dougal and Florence)
    Zebedee, Jun 2, 2004
  9. David James

    Alan Brennan Guest

    On Wed, 2 Jun 2004 18:12:18 +0100
    Zebedee ( [email protected] )
    Caveat empore. There is always going to be a risk buying something sight
    unseen from an unknown seller. Stuff is cheap on ebay because, as in any
    auction, there is an element of risk. That is why Ebay has put some
    measures into place to protect buyers and sellers, and by and large
    those measures work. I have bought scores of things off ebay with not
    one single problem, and I live on the other side of the world from most
    of the people I deal with. With a common brand of camera like the one
    the OP was buying, there will be a dozen on ebay at any one time. Why
    did he chose the one from the guy with a string of negative feedbacks as
    long as your arm?
    Yeah right. Al Qaida is financing its world wide organisation by fencing
    dodgy cameras on ebay. It's brilliant thinking like this which has
    allowed you yanks to make such a rip roaring success of Iraq.
    Alan Brennan, Jun 2, 2004
  10. David James

    Zebedee Guest

    Quite honestly, anybody that believes ebay feedback can't have thought
    through the way the system works. I found one easy way to get negative
    feedback removed was to put obscene feedback in its place. Both sets of
    comments get nuked when the guy who's had the obscene comment against them
    complains. Had an obscene comment directed at me by a non-paying bidder who
    I commented as "Non-paying bidder". I had more dodgy buyers/sellers than
    honest ones so I abandoned ebay to the scumbags.
    I'm not a Yank. But... how much criminal money is laundered through ebay?



    (Claiming asylum in an attempt
    to escape paying his debts to
    Dougal and Florence)
    Zebedee, Jun 3, 2004
  11. David James

    traveler Guest

    I've made several successful purchases on ebay. It takes a lot of
    time to research any particular item and watch over two or three weeks
    what the good ones are selling for. That is the main problem with
    buying on ebay, all the time one must put in so that when you are
    ready to bid, you know what you are bidding on, what you are willing
    to pay, and that you will have a good chance to win. Intelligent
    shopping on ebay requires a real committment in time and energy. I
    bought a Russian movie camera from a guy in Uzbekistan and I couldn't
    be happier with it. He was a conscientious man who did his best to
    make me happy with the purchase. There were many of them for sale and
    no particular pressure to settle on any particular camera. I paid
    more for mine than most of the others were going for and I'm glad I
    did. It works very well. I recently bought a dry mount press in
    excellent condition that does a superb job. It wasn't cheap, of
    course, but much less expensive than when it was new. Somewhat less
    wonderful, I spent quite a bit on a moviola table top viewer because I
    was tired of losing auctions and the bidding went inordinately high.
    Although it's well made and in excellent condition, I'm somewhat
    disappointed in its performance. On the other hand, I bought a movie
    screen that I'm very happy with, and got a great deal on a 16mm
    projector. It's in mint condition and it only cost twenty bucks! If
    you're willing to put the time in, ebay can be a good place to obtain
    certain items, especially if you don't live in a big city and must
    shop online or via catalogues for many items. Shipping is always
    expensive and you have to wait, sometimes too long, to get your item.
    Sellers often don't know how to deal with a person who pays them via
    Paypal immediately after the auction. They are used to taking their
    sweet time and it gets a bit frustrating now and then.
    On the down side, I was in the market for a motorcycle and came
    across a real scam artist who didn't expose his con until I'd won the
    item. He had 100% positive feedback (mostly from sellers) but was a
    real sneak who knew exactly what not to divulge (he claimed to be an
    employee of ebay). But there was no way I was going to buy from this
    guy once he'd tipped his hand. He was selling a motorcycle for his
    son who was in the Navy and "out to sea," so I naturally assumed that
    the bike was in his possession. No, as it turned out, his contact
    information showed that he was in Utah, nowhere near the bike, which
    was in Chula Vista, south of San Diego. His son wasn't in town to
    transfer ownership, either, yet pop demanded that I immediately send
    him a deposit and then find a way to pay his absent son another $3300
    for the bike. Either he was a complete scam artist or the two of them
    were Oliver and Hardy. Was I to hop a bus for Chula Vista with a
    cashier's check for big bucks in my pocket and hope someone would be
    there to sell me a bike? No fucking way, no matter how much negative
    feedback he might give me. Struck me as a good way to end up face
    down in an alley or something. As a result, he caused me a problem by
    complaining that I was "a nonpaying bidder" (translation: I won't be
    conned quite that easily). Ebay was giving me a hassle about it until
    they'd heard the whole story and I'd threatened to close my account if
    they didn't like it. At this point, I wouldn't even consider buying
    any big ticket items like a motorcycle on ebay. I'd spent weeks
    wasting my time looking for one and came up with nothing but a
    headache. Either the reserves are set too high or there is just too
    much competition in the bidding. But for smaller items, there are
    good conscientious sellers and good trustworthy buyers. Communication
    is the most important thing. If you get someone who won't
    communicate, forget it. If they will, it is fairly easy to ask many
    good questions and find out just what the item is really like. Of
    course, all it takes is one thief to throw the whole trust thing into
    the crapper. I won't be buying on ebay for some time to come.
    traveler, Jun 3, 2004
  12. David James

    Mike Kohary Guest

    It's easy to get burned if you're not careful, and even if you are careful.
    :) I think Ebay is a lot better for things like collectibles than
    electronics, though. When I'm looking for the childhood comic, Ebay is the
    place to be. If I'm looking for a camera, it's not.

    Mike Kohary, Jun 3, 2004
  13. David James

    Patrick L. Guest

    I took a big gamble, once, on ebay, and bought and E1 with a lens. Both
    were in pristine condition, for about $800 less than I could have bought it
    at a store.

    I was lucky.

    Patrick L., Jun 4, 2004
  14. I agree--sounds like you should blame the eBay system.
    Olympus seems to have done everything right.
    (My backup digital cam is an old 2020Z that still takes EXCELLENT
    low-light night shots. I sent it in for cleaning once, and Olympus did
    quality work on it.)
    Bill in Alexandria, Jun 6, 2004
  15. David James

    Matti Vuori Guest

    What on earth has the eBay _system_ to do with this?
    Matti Vuori, Jun 6, 2004

  16. If you read my message ("Olympus refurbished BEWARE <-more details"),
    you'll note this discussion is about a failed eBay auction. Many feel eBay
    policies (the "system") are weighted too far in favor of the seller. For
    example, eBay's policy of not requiring the seller's name and verified
    address to be posted on each auction invites fraud. Using fake names, a
    seller can easily close accounts with bad feedback and open others using a
    different fake name under a different credit card. This would not be so easy
    if the auction was focused around a seller's specific name and address.

    In the past, eBay claimed this policy was designed to protect sellers from
    "spam bots" which collect info off web sites. Buyers immediately responded
    that this could be done by providing a link on each auction page, open only
    to registered eBay users, to provide this information. To this date, eBay
    has done nothing to address this issue and the fraud continues.

    Of course, there are complaints about other policies, but this one seems
    to be the most common complaint seen on their forums.

    Dwight Stewart
    Dwight Stewart, Jun 6, 2004
  17. David James

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Well, I wouldn't exactly blame eBay either...it's just a matter of
    being careful, and understanding that when you buy things off eBay,
    there are risks involved that you wouldn't incur in a transaction with
    a retailer.

    Mike Kohary, Jun 7, 2004
  18. David James

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Ebay requires a valid credit card for each seller account, so the seller's
    name and verified address (at least per what is listed on the credit card
    account) is attached to each auction. A seller can still close down an
    account and open a new one, but as you note, they will need a different
    credit card. There are only so many times a person can do this, and it
    seems it would be difficult to fake a name short of stealing someone else's
    credit card.

    Mike Kohary, Jun 9, 2004

  19. That information (seller's actual name and address) is known only to eBay,
    which does not share it with buyers (when requested, during a disputed
    auction, or whatever). At the present time, the only way to get that
    information from eBay is through a court order. Do you realise how difficult
    it is to obtain a court order like this?

    And naivety like this is exactly why con artists are so successful on
    eBay. The games on eBay are nearly endless. For example, a local pawn shop
    (a block from my house) has been thrown off eBay at least five times that
    I'm aware of. They keep getting away with it by having employees set up
    accounts under their own names, using their own credit cards. Considering
    this pawn shop has eight or nine constantly changing employees, each with
    one or two credit cards, they could continue this forever. And the employees
    have very little to worry about - after all, it's very difficult to even
    find out their real names and addresses.

    Dwight Stewart
    Dwight Stewart, Jun 10, 2004
  20. David James

    MFP Guest

    I've bought several items off ebay and been satisfied every time.

    course, i go by a few ground rules.

    noone with more than 1% bad reviews

    noone with any recent bad reviews

    never spend more than 100 dollars.

    pretty simple.
    MFP, Jun 10, 2004
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