Panasonic 24p capture question.

Discussion in 'Professional Video Production' started by Paul Melo, Jul 21, 2003.

  1. Paul Melo

    Paul Melo Guest

    Hi,

    If I shoot using the Panasonic DVX100 in 24p mode, can I use a standard
    minidv camera at the regular 29.97fps rate to play and capture the footage?

    Any issues to consider?

    Thanks,

    Melo
     
    Paul Melo, Jul 21, 2003
    #1
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  2. Paul Melo

    David McCall Guest

    AFAIK it is recorded to tape as normal DV video (60i in NTSC). The difference
    is in the way the information is captured and sent to the recorder. The images
    are captured at true 24p, but they have their own special format for putting the
    frames to tape.

    You should do some searching on the web, if you want reliable information.
    Normally 24p gets transferred to video using a 3-2 pulldown. I think that means
    that 3 fields of frame 1, 2 fields of frame 2, 3 fields of frame 3, 2 fields of frame
    4, etc.. Panasonic has another way of doing it, but I've never really taken the time
    to understand it. Some how they are avoiding the split frames of the 3/2 scheme.

    You can edit it as normal video, or you can use software that knows about
    Panasonic's 24p scheme to convert it to true 24p (it will no longer be video,
    until you apply 3-2 pull down)

    David
     
    David McCall, Jul 21, 2003
    #2
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  3. Panasonic does it the other way around. Records at true 24fps and then
    a reverse-pulldown to make it visible on a normal monitor. If your
    NLE-software supports native 24fps, you can see what you actually
    recorded.

    -martin-
     
    Martin Heffels, Jul 21, 2003
    #3
  4. Paul Melo

    David McCall Guest

    It records on in the DV format on DV tape. It captures the images
    in the camera at true 24P, but there is no true 24P DV players.
    As far as the device playing, or editing, the video is concerned it
    is just DV video. If you look at the tape frame by frame, you will
    see duplicated frames.

    There have been software packages that can remove the 3-2 pull
    down to reconstruct the original 24p (Aftereffects does), but the
    Panasonic scheme is too new to be common yet. I was reading
    something the other day that said that it was ready for the scheme,
    but I don't remember who. I'm thinking Vegas or Final Cut.

    David
     
    David McCall, Jul 21, 2003
    #4
  5. Paul Melo

    thrillcat Guest

    Vegas 4.0 has templates specifically designed for the Panasonic AGDVX100.
    They remove the 3-2 pulldown or the 2-3-3-2 pulldown the camera uses in 24Pa
    mode, to edit at true 24p.

    You must download updates a, b, & c from Sonic Foundry's website to get
    these templates. They weren't in the initial build (although the capability
    was still there).
     
    thrillcat, Jul 21, 2003
    #5
  6. Paul Melo

    David McCall Guest

    That must have been where I saw it. Thanks.
    I think I get it now.
    with 3-2 pull down wind up with source frames that are split between 2 different
    video frames. While this provides a little smoother playback, it is more difficult
    to reconstruct the 24p. With 2-3-3-2 you get all of the source frames as full
    frames, and the split frames can just be thrown away. This would be relatively
    simple to program compared to 3-2.

    So, in this scheme, both fields of the first video frame are the 1st 24p frame,
    the next 2 fields are the second source frame,
    the next 2 video fields are split between source frame 2 and source frame 3
    (this video frame can just be chucked),
    the next 2 video fields contain the full source frame 3, and
    the next 2 video fields are source frame 4, then it repeats.

    Seems perfectly reasonable now :)
     
    David McCall, Jul 21, 2003
    #6
  7. Paul Melo

    thrillcat Guest

    thrillcat, Jul 21, 2003
    #7
  8. On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 16:00:24 GMT, "David McCall"

    Your description was right, it's the 24p adnaced mode. For people who
    still can't picture <pun intended> it, check-out the ever-knowledgable
    Adam Wilt's website for a illustrated version :)
    http://www.adamwilt.com/24p/index.html

    cheers

    -martin-
     
    Martin Heffels, Jul 22, 2003
    #8
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