photo editing software

Discussion in 'Photography' started by cherylp, Jul 10, 2008.

  1. cherylp

    John Guest

    For those interested, there are currently 52 free Gimp topic
    tutorials at:

    The first couple are very good about how to use it, and how
    to set up preferences. And there is a new one each week.

    John, Jul 17, 2008
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  2. That is not true. Anyone who learns to use a web search
    tool can find more GIMP tutorials and information than
    they need.
    No wonder you think GIMP is hard!
    Those are simple facts that are true for both PS and GIMP.
    AT $600+ a pop for PS, it is an advantage of huge
    proportion. But in fact that is not really the only

    GIMP runs on just about any platform. GIMP, as OSS, is
    more likely to be secure, and definitely has a shorter
    bug fix cycle time.

    For those who are so inclined, GIMP is also easier to write
    plugins or scripts (Python, for example) for.
    Your personal bias is interesting, but it is not
    particularly helpful to others. Neither GIMP or PS is
    necessarily intuitive or easy, but if you learn one of
    them first it is absolutely going to be harder to learn
    the other.

    Despite that I have seen several people who were
    "relatively" familiar with PS, though not yet
    compfortable with it, take one look at GIMP and gush
    with how they liked the interface better because it was
    more intuitive for them. (And I have no doubt at all that
    the exact same thing happens in the opposite direction.)

    The fact is that some people are much more inclined
    towards one or the other of them; but that does not
    override the difficulty of unlearning one in order to
    learn the other (which is where your bias originated).
    Floyd L. Davidson, Jul 17, 2008
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  3. cherylp

    tony cooper Guest

    What classes, books, and magazine articles are there about Gimp?
    There are Gimp tutorials online, but relatively few compared to
    Photoshop. The problem with "relatively few" is that not all
    tutorials are equal. Not all are written well or easy to follow. If
    you can pull up several tutorials on a technique, you can mentally
    combine them to figure out any technique. If there's only one or two,
    it may not be as easy.
    I don't think Gimp is hard. I've tried it, and found it to be about
    the same as Photoshop: you need outside sources to learn the
    techniques. It's the availability of outside sources that is
    mentioned above.
    No personal bias on your part, eh, Floyd?
    A statement was made here that Gimp is more "intuitive" than
    Photoshop. Statements have been made that Photoshop is harder to
    learn than Gimp. These prompted my comments.

    When my daughter wanted to start on a program to edit photos, I
    recommended Elements. The full Photoshop version would have been far
    too expensive for her, and Gimp is lacking in outside sources of
    information. Elements, at the $50 she paid for it, was the best
    choice for her. The tutorials, books, and online forums are out
    there. With the exception of "Curves", she has a program that is very
    comparable to the full Photoshop package and one that suits her needs.

    There are some people who started on Photoshop either because of their
    employment or with the intent to be employed in a field that required
    the use of Photoshop and bought Photoshop because that's what they
    were trained on.

    There's also a large group of hobbyist users who are on full Photoshop
    now and started on Photoshop when it was more affordable in cost or
    when we could buy it at the educational price. Elements was either
    not yet available or did not include the features it now includes.

    I suspect that most Gimp users are hobbyists who started on Gimp
    because of the price barrier of the full Photoshop and were unaware
    that Elements could do what it does. I can't imagine choosing Gimp
    because it is a better program.
    tony cooper, Jul 17, 2008
  4. cherylp

    Joel Guest

    It's sad but true, as for over a decade many people claimed Paint Shop Pro
    is just as good as Photoshop (few even claimed better) but easier to learn.
    Yup! they got the idea from an article on either Computer Shoppers or
    PC-Magine way way back in sometime late 80's or so.

    Then like the same sour lime (or same old whining), it went downhill no
    brake after Corel took over <bg>. And same with Corel Painter, many people
    don't realize that there is more than just the interface, because I have
    tried several version of Corel Painter (or Corel Paint?) and I can see the
    SAVED quality is very bad. Yup! I started with Corel Draw v3.x which I paid
    around $15-20 for the whole suite, and I was aiming for the Clip Arts,
    upgraded to 2 newer versions (because it's cheap) just to check them out.
    Joel, Jul 17, 2008
  5. cherylp

    Joel Guest

    It's exactly what the man said *few* comparing to Photoshop.
    Joel, Jul 17, 2008
  6. cherylp

    Joel Guest

    Photoshop CS3 is what my grand-daughter started with little over a year
    ago, and she is now working part-time (she just finished her 1st year in
    college) working with Photoshop and In Design (or something like that).

    She will leave for college next month (8 hrs drive) and the company wants
    her to continue to work for them through internet (probably by the work not
    hour). Right now she only work 3 days a week.
    That's one of the reasons why I chose and stick with Photoshop in the
    first place. And I advice my grand-kids to invest in Photoshop instead of
    wasting their time on others then need to undo later.

    And I just can't be able to figure out how someone can find one program is
    easier than other when they don't know both well enough. Or to most if not
    all Photoshop users (I am talking about the ones who know Photoshop well
    enough *not* the one who tried and gave up) Photoshop should be easier or
    easiest because they know it well enough.
    Joel, Jul 17, 2008
  7. cherylp

    Cats Guest

    I doubt very much that the OP wants to spend 6 months learning to use
    one rather expensive product to fix his/her problem when 6 days would
    be more than enough with another free one.

    If the OP is still here, Irfanview is free and will do everything you
    need to do to get resized images saved in a different name.
    Cats, Jul 17, 2008
  8. Nonsense. If that were true nobody would buy Photoshop. Hobbyists
    might get by with a hodge-podge of freeware applications but to claim
    that no photographer needs a program like Photoshop is either ill
    considered or extremely naive nonsense. Hobbyists can make do,
    professionals need to consider work-flow, updates, compatibility with
    new products, and support.

    What arrogance, to decide whether another person needs something or not.

    I use Photoshop because I have found it to be without doubt the best
    tool for the job, not for brand loyalty or a desire to waste money.

    You are a pompous idiot.

    Lucid Lunatic, Jul 17, 2008
  9. So, you don't know anything about the listed programs, do you!
    Well, I sure didn't spend $600 on a program I don't need...
    but you did!
    Floyd L. Davidson, Jul 17, 2008
  10. No, it is you who seems to know very little. I am a primarily a
    unix/linux Mac user, have been since college. I have been very
    conversant with all unix/linux based software for many years. I am very
    familiar with gimp, I used it before I had access to Photoshop. I also
    have experience and appreciation for Cinepaint, though I have not played
    with Glasgow as yet, though all reports indicate that it is as buggy,
    unreliable, and poorly ported as anything could possibly be. Yet you
    recommend it to someone who is a Windows user? As for raw manipulation,
    I have numerous apps that will handle that if I don't want to use Photoshop.

    What I said still stands, these will not be a better option than
    Photoshop for most photographers, particularly those who have little
    interest in computers and their various OS. Photoshop meets a need, a
    professional need and meets it very well.
    No, I have all software supplied, I just make a request. I pay nothing.

    Lucid Lunatic, Jul 18, 2008
  11. You still aren't catching the drift...

    Photoshop may well be the most popular, and it clearly
    does meet the needs of professionals. GIMP may not be
    the most popular, but it clearly *does* meet the needs
    of most photographers, professionals included.

    In most cases the only real difference is that if they
    are already familar with the Windows way of doing
    things, and if they have the money, they might as well
    use Photoshop. Obviously that simply does not work at
    all if they are using any form of Unix.

    The foolishness of running Windows is an entirely
    different topic...
    Floyd L. Davidson, Jul 18, 2008
  12. cherylp

    tony cooper Guest

    It's getting hard to the read your post with all the dust that your
    backpedaling is raising.

    You've got the choice of Photoshop down to an accessory to the crime
    of using Windows. Are you not aware that most users of Photoshop are
    on Macs and not at all familiar with the "Windows way of doing

    Yes, there are users of Photoshop who are on Windows. I'm one of
    them. To say, though, that the use of Windows is a reason that people
    chose Photoshop is - to be kind - uninformed. We Windows people are
    just trying to keep up with Mac people when it comes to Photoshop.
    tony cooper, Jul 18, 2008
  13. No it doesn't. A working professional needs a fast workflow above all
    else, that's its weakness. There are many areas where it is more
    difficult and time consuming to achieve a result using gimp than it is
    using Photoshop.
    Windows has nothing to do with the issue, Photoshop started with Mac.
    And if they rollerblade backwards they can see where they've been. Most
    use either Mac or Windows.
    The foolishness and pointlessness of disparaging windows when a windows
    using OP asks for software advice shows your true colors.

    I still think that you are a pompous idiot and everything you say
    encourages that impression. The original question was a request for
    software advice from a Windows user. You segue into a rant about Linux.
    If a woman had asked for advice about a sports bra, you answer would be
    that she should have been born a man. Get over yourself, I have and it
    wasn't difficult.

    Lucid Lunatic, Jul 18, 2008
  14. And *you* are calling *me* names???

    Logical you are not.
    Floyd L. Davidson, Jul 18, 2008
  15. cherylp

    Joel Guest

    6 months just to get you started, and you may be looking at years to
    master some of it. As I have mentioned (assuming you are 50-60 years old),
    if the OP want to invest in a professional photo retouching tool, then s/he
    don't want to waste his/her time on Irfanview or similar, else s/he still
    won't go very far 50-60 years later (like yourself).

    So again, go for it $600 is a very very very cheap price to pay for the
    knowledge (good investment) which poor free stuff can be very very very
    expensive price you have to pay for the wrong choice (example you have
    wasted lot of years to learn something more useful and much much much more

    Don't you think many people and I don't know what Irfanview is? or many of
    us may have known it's free many many years before many Irfanview users do
    (I believe it has been around for 7-8+ years, and I have only looked at it
    twice). Or I don't even want to use it as graphic viewer (it's no provlem
    displaying the image, but lacking of some small feature for some specific
    Joel, Jul 18, 2008
  16. cherylp

    Cats Guest

    Quite. The OP has a simple little problem and a simple little
    solution is appropriate IMHO, not using a behemoth that they don't
    The OP hasn't said how old they are or if they want to use a more
    advanced photo editing tool. However judging by their confusion at
    simple things such as 'Save as' and finding the resizing dialog box,
    they are a completely naive user when it comes to photo editing, and
    pretty naive when it comes to Windows. IMHO They have a lot to learn
    before something like CS3 won't leave them feeling totally bemused.
    $600 is cheap? I'd hate to hear what you think is expensive.
    I guess you'd use the same twisted kind of logic to recommend a
    database as well, but I can assure you that if you learn *concepts* as
    well as 'how to', most of the knowledge is transferable both with
    databases and with photo editing software. There is no conceptual
    difference between resizing in IfranView, CS3, PaintShopPro and all
    other editing software, just a slightly different dialog box to find.

    My remark was for the OP who clearly had never heard of IrfanView
    before this thread started.

    I wonder how carefully you looked at it? Or did you throw your hands
    up in horror because it's not a CS3 clone?

    You don't but many, many others do.
    Cats, Jul 18, 2008
  17. cherylp

    Joel Guest

    May be the OP has very little problem, but it seems like you are the one
    with biggest problem (the problem accepting the truth).
    Then the "Cats" can say it because YOU = the Cats.
    The world may look the same to everyone, but actually it could be lot more
    complex than some may think. Just like this conversation, I said "YOU" and
    the Cats confuses YOU as a 3rd person.

    You seems to have the wrong idea of learning. Yes, I did learn other 2nd
    languages before English (English is my 3rd of the foreign languages I
    learn), but I am 100% sure it doesn't require me (or in some case it may not
    be a good idea) to learn other language to help me learn English.
    Go back to untwist any part you think I twisted see you can come up with
    the untwisted story. And I can't and won't try to help you to understand or
    to know the differences, or most people can only be able to give so much
    information then one has to learn oneself.

    Me? if you pay attention and understand what I have been talking here on
    both Software and Hardware.

    - Software, I always suggest people to invest their time and energy on the
    best for their future

    - Hardware, like LENS I always suggest to save money for the Top_Of_The_Line
    lens. Or I often suggest people not to waste money on the cheapie lens.

    Yes, you may say the cheap lens can capture the same image the expensive
    lens does, but I am talking about the "quality" and "more opportunity" to
    capture on many different situation at better quality. That's what I try to
    Well, I do know what "cats" are *but* I have never have any conversation
    with the "Cats" before exchanging few Usenet messages with you. IOW, you
    just need to go back and stick with the MAIN thing instead of shooting

    Or there are millions of millions of things we don't know, or
    misunderstanding, so I am not supervised that the OP doesn't know InfanView
    and many others.
    Very careful because I know exactly what I want, and it didn't have it and
    may not have it now. But that doesn't matter because it's a minor thing but
    useful for some of us.
    How do you feel if I say "I agree with what you say above"?. See, even
    you have been trying to find any different ways to disagree with me, and I
    still agree when you think straight <bg>
    Joel, Jul 18, 2008
  18. cherylp

    Cats Guest

    Does anyone know what this means? Does he mean he agrees with me when
    I agree with him? Do we all have to take the Joel line about solving
    the OP's problem and tell them to buy CS3? (I think that was his line
    but it's not always clear because his command of written English isn't
    Cats, Jul 19, 2008
  19. cherylp

    tony cooper Guest

    If you can't follow what he says, then your command of written English
    isn't that good either.

    You disagree with him in many things. Even when you disagree with
    Joel, he sees your point when you are thinking straight.
    tony cooper, Jul 19, 2008
  20. cherylp

    Joel Guest

    Which means denying or won't accept the truth is one of your main
    problems. Or you will find other reason to disagree with whatever other
    tries to explain to you.

    No, Joel suggested the OP to shoot for the star, and trying to solve the
    problem "Cats" has *not* the OP.
    Joel, Jul 19, 2008
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