Raw Convertors

Back that up

I did not have to... other people made the claims about Gcc I simply
asked them to back them up.

 

I'm confused here. Why are you on about what the Romans did in response to
a statement about the Germans lacking a written language?

 

not at all. i have the choice to run software from virtually *any*
supplier i want.

 

User interface is one area that Microsoft does not do well.

 

Not to companies who want the fruits of free and open software,
*and* do *not* want their customers to whom they pass on these
programs to enjoy the same fruits, no, there the GPL is bad news.


If you want to play fair and cooperatively there's no problem.

-Wolfgang

 

So certification houses basically accept your word on "I
haven't found validation (and didn't look for it), so the GCC
must be worse than non-validated commercial products"? Hooray!
That's quality work!
Keep up the good work!

No compiler has ever passed all tests. I asked you, you
didn't answer, so that's positive proof.

You need new glasses. Oh, nothing that has been shown in
this thread so has in any way shown that the ISO standard and
the industry accepted test suits are properly tested.

Hence they are as bad as the GCC, by *your* logic.

.... is impossible. In other news, the UN has stopped all
combat everywhere, as it's internationally accepted.

Empirical evidence is aboundant and publically available to
anyone who'd like to see. You don't want to see (it's bad
for your business), hence no pointers for you.

Some stay in it and go into validation business.

-Wolfgang

 

I was referring to the last half of your sentence (after the
conjunction) "their German adversaries lacked same." It is the German
adversaries who used Greek to communicate.--- obtuseness snipped -----



Eric Stevens

 

My apologies. I hadn't heard of the evidence that some of the Gauls
and Huns of the time communicated between themselves in written Greek,
and mistakenly assumed it was the Romans' literacy which was being
discussed.

 

I can't remember the details but about 8 or 10 years ago there was
discussion in sci.archaeology as to whether or not the druids had
writing. The common view is that they don't but someone produced
evidence that some of the druids (and the rulers) communicated amongst
themselves using greek scripts.



Eric Stevens

 

<edited>

Hello, Eric:

There's no documented evidence that any of the Germanic tribes >wrote<
Greek, unfortunately.

 

Hello, Wolfgang:

False argument; you're only referring to the >degree< of literacy.
The Germans of yore were thoroughly illiterate, plain and simple.

They were barbarians, of course.

Nonsense. Slavery was a fairly widespread phenomenon, throughout the
ages. It even lasted in the United States, until 1865!

Irrelevant to the issue at hand: Your "Nordic" ancestors were very
clearly inferior to the Mediterranean peoples of the ancient world.

Two millennia ago, some Germanic tribes "ganged up" and routed
three Roman legions, in the Battle of the Teutoburg Forest.

So what?

Those horrible Huns were sick puppies, indeed!

Nah, I'll pass...why don't >you< research "German measles,"
instead? <g>

 

Hello, Chris:

You pinheaded Pom, you! Why, I thought it was common knowledge that
Italian, French, Spanish, Portuguese and Romanian, are all based on
Greek.

Latin was only used by pigs, as all clever Kiwis (e.g., Eric Stevens)
are well aware.

 

<full attributions restored>

Hello, Jürgen:

When have I ever equated "civilization" with "morality," eh? Whether
practiced by nations of antquity (such as Rome and Greece) or far more
modern ones (e.g., Great Britain and the USA), slavery has invariably
existed as a dark side of human nature.

<edited for brevity>

Which is the basic point that I've been trying to make, to Wolfgang
Weisselberg: The Germans of old were severely handicapped by their
disorganized tribal societies, and essentially lacked most of the
hallmarks of the vastly superior Mediterranean cultures.

In an ideal world, "physical force" and "warfare" would be bizarre
fantasies, rather than the brutal realities they've always been.

 

Hello, Eric:

I - not Chris Malcolm - typed that line (and I still stand by it).

Now, who's being "obtuse?" Such "archaeological evidence" scarcely
qualifies as proof of anything substantial, and merely reflects the
subjective interpretations of the theorist(s) in question.

 

Hello, Eric:

The druids were Gaulic, not Germanic.

 

If literacy is civilisation, more literacy is more civilisation.

Still waiting for your definition of civilisation ...

If that's your acid test for civilisation ...
But that weren't "Germans", that were "Germanic tribes".
You keep mixing them up, that's as stupid as calling English,
which is a Germanic language, "German".

Bzzzt.
That was a false dilemma, there is of course more than "civilized"
and "barbarian". Ever hear of "nomads", for example?

Unless you are thinking the old Roman and Greek way: Everyone
who is not "us" is a barbarian --- and in that sense the Germanic
tribes certainly were barbarians.

Sure was, but organized mass slave sales is something else.
Murder happens everywhere at every time, but organized mass murder?

As if the US were the gold standard of civilisation
themselves, much as they'd like to think themselves thus ...

"America is the only nation in history which miraculously has
gone directly from barbarism to degeneration without the usual
interval of civilization." (Attributed to Clemenceau)

Hmmm. I see.
Inferior measured by what meter?

The 3 legions were utterly destroyed, not just routed, not just
decimated[1] a few times. Their personnel was mostly killed
or enslaved. The legions were never resurrected again, unique
in the Roman military history.

The Romans got a pretty bloody nose. Imagine "a gaggle of
illiterate Mexican street kids trowing stones"[2] repell and utterly
destroy a full scale assault of the whole US military might hell
bend on conquering Mexico. That sort of bloody nose. Not
just a 'Waterloo' type bloody nose.

So, would they call themselves barbarians? By *their*
definition?

That one is easy ... German doctors discovered it. How about
"Spanish flu"?

-Wolfgang

[1] Another quaint Roman habit: killing every 10th man as a
unit punishment.
[2] At least that's what the cameras would show, a bit more
technology is involved.

 

Hello, Wolfgang:

Naturally, I was cognizant of this fact.

Then, you should be equally aware that those "Roman legions" were
composed of mercenaries (e.g., Germanics), as well as the Romans,
themselves.

Nomads can also be barbarians, no? They're not mutually exclusive.

Uncouth and overly aggressive, by any and all civilized standards.

Certainly! While the "Final Solution" is the most systematic and
widespread example of "mass murder," it's far from the lone one.

For instance, the Turkish massacre of Armenian civilians (during
World War I) is still hotly debated. Many nations now officially
recognize this gruesome incident as an unmitigated act of genocide.

Coming from a debauched Frenchman, that's quite a compliment,

As measured by the advanced cultures of the time (Greece, Rome,
China, et al).

Yeah, and imagine a conferation of Indian tribes, annihilating
an entire regiment of the mighty U.S. Army! That happened in the
famous Battle of the Little Bighorn, of 1876.

Little Bighorn wasn't even the most devastating defeat the
"Native Americans" inflicted upon the White Man. In 1791, at
the Battle of the Wabash, an Indian condederacy demolished
the Caucasian invaders. In terms of per-capita decimation, it
remains the worst loss in the proud history of the U.S. armed
forces.

That's right, my dear Wolfman! In two world wars, the highly
mechanized Germans never gave the "degenerate" Americans such
a "bloody nose," as the "lowly" Red Man of the 19th century
did.

The "Yanks" pretty much rode roughshod over the vaunted
"Heer," I might asdd. The Germans' only major victory was
their initial engagement with U.S. elements (Battle of the
Kasserine Pass; February 19–25, 1943).

Whether we're discussing Romans vs Germanics, or Americans
vs Indians, the main common denominator is this: Soldiers
vs warriors. True, the latter won some individual battles,
but, it didn't make them suddenly capable of sophisticated
warfare.

They probably called themselves a great and noble people. ;-)

A European outbreak of influenza, of the WWI era; it was thought
to have originated in Spain.

Naughty, naughty! I want the Geneva Convention to hand those

If German technology couldn't thwart the U.S. military machine,
what chance do the Mexicans have? Neither bratwurst nor burritos,
shall halt Manifest Destiny!