Sigma SD15 - why? But Fuji sensor sounds promising..

Discussion in 'Fuji' started by Mark Thomas, Sep 28, 2008.

  1. Mark Thomas

    Mark Thomas Guest

    It all started with the SD9 - 3.4Mp.., then the SD10 - 4.6Mp, then the
    SD14 - 4.6Mp... And now, continuing their ever upward progress..
    http://www.sigmaphoto.com/news/news.asp?nID=3440

    The SD15!! at...... 4.6Mp. Same sensor. Why, Sigma/Foveon? You've
    had how many years now to extract more out of this sensor? Maybe you
    should give up?

    But maybe the new processing engine can do something about the slightly
    twisted colours and jaundiced fleshtones. Maybe the noise (and general)
    performance might be incrementally better/faster. But exactly the same
    sensor, and no more resolution. Presumably it still has no a-a filter,
    so the Sigma jaggies will still pretend to be detail. I wonder if they
    will just recycle their old patched up sample images for the new camera?

    At least the new Fuji sensor looks promising - it's nice to see them
    acknowledge that the F20/30 series was about as good a sensor as they
    have ever produced, and unlike Foveon they seem to be moving forward:
    http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092308fujifilm.asp

    If they successfully extrapolate to a larger sensor... (O:
     
    Mark Thomas, Sep 28, 2008
    #1
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  2. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    The Gentec rep had an SD14 in the store, but we declined stocking them.
     
    Guest, Sep 28, 2008
    #2
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  3. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    Retailers seldom sell new merchandise on consignment. We looked at it, and
    based on the fact in 4 years, nobody had ever asked about a Sigma dSLR or
    even a film Sigma SLR camera
     
    Guest, Sep 28, 2008
    #3
  4. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    the sd10 was also 3.4 mp. it had the exact same sensor as the sd9 but
    with the addition of microlenses. however, that's when the deception
    began and it was marketed as 10 megapixels.
    i'm wondering how long it will be until they do give up. they can't be
    making money on them.
    the people who buy them like the aliased jaggy look and blame the
    photographer for getting the wrong colours. seriously.
    did you know that their sample images are photoshopped in some cases,
    and sometimes significantly so?
    there is also the kodak sensor:
    <http://www.dpreview.com/news/0706/07061401kodakhighsens.asp>
     
    Guest, Sep 28, 2008
    #4
  5. Mark Thomas

    Mark Thomas Guest

    I guess they are making enough to keep foveon producing sensors, just
    not doing any development...
    Yes, I've noticed this. And I'll even admit that a tiny bit of added
    yellow often helps fleshtones... But some of the Sigma tones are so
    weirdly twisted that getting neutral colour is very difficult. And at
    higher iso's? Not funny.

    Yes, and I think that practice is disgraceful. It reflects very poorly
    on Sigma that they don't believe sample images should be straight from
    the camera.
    Kodak seem to struggle to make low noise, high DR sensors, at least in
    the lower end of the market.. (Which is where I shall probably remain..!)
     
    Mark Thomas, Sep 28, 2008
    #5
  6. Mark Thomas

    Mark Thomas Guest

    Me neither. I do quite like the Foveon 'cleanness', but the lack of AA
    is a big mistake, and I couldn't imagine using it as a people camera..
    Yes, Fuji are saying they won't use it for large sensors. But there is
    a large gap between P&S/zlr/bridge cameras and APS-C - it's nbice to see
    Fuji and the 4/3 crowd (eg Panasonic G1) addressing it.

    I've been watching the 4/3 sensors very closely, and their high iso
    performance has been steadily improving. Of course it will never match
    an APS-C or FF sensor (as 35mm will never match MF..), but to me the
    balance between portability and decent image quality (and maybe even a
    decent evf) makes these cameras very tempting.. I think the next gen of
    G1-ish cameras will be very interesting.
     
    Mark Thomas, Sep 28, 2008
    #6
  7. Mark Thomas

    RichA Guest

    Fuji is out of the DSLR game, so unless you're buying a P&S.....
     
    RichA, Sep 29, 2008
    #7
  8. Mark Thomas

    RichA Guest

    RichA, Sep 29, 2008
    #8
  9. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    due to the way the sensor works, getting accurate colour is actually
    impossible. different input colours produce the same output colour.
    plus, it has more noise than the same size bayer sensor.
    it's not all that surprising from a company that outright lies about
    the pixel count.
     
    Guest, Sep 29, 2008
    #9
  10. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    cameras can be a lot smaller with micro 4/3rds, and still produce
    decent quality photos. there are a number of rumours that nikon/canon
    have aps size compacts coming. should be interesting...
     
    Guest, Sep 29, 2008
    #10
  11. Mark Thomas

    * Guest

    Sigma/Foveon keeps the same sensor and changes their math each year...
     
    *, Oct 22, 2008
    #11
  12. Mark Thomas

    Ian Johnston Guest

    The importer came into the store last year and was almost begging us to take
    in some SD14 dSLR, we declined, but can get them in on special order... to
    date nobody have ever asked for one.
     
    Ian Johnston, Oct 22, 2008
    #12
  13. I have.
    They really exist.

    -Wolfgang
     
    Wolfgang Weisselberg, Oct 22, 2008
    #13
  14. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    actually, they changed the math between the sd9 and sd10, when it went
    from 3.4 to 10.2 megapixels. the sd14 and dp1 have a 4.6 megapixel
    sensor that sigma calls 14 megapixels, and it's the same one that will
    be in the sd15 and dp2.
     
    Guest, Oct 23, 2008
    #14
  15. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    an actual person using one?? or in a store, waiting to be sold?
     
    Guest, Oct 23, 2008
    #15
  16. Both at once: In a store (ano not even a camera store, but general
    electronics), held in the hands of a prospective buyer.

    -Wolfgang
     
    Wolfgang Weisselberg, Oct 23, 2008
    #16
  17. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    did he ultimately buy it? maybe he was just curious, and once he saw
    how clunky and slow it really is, he opted for something else...
     
    Guest, Oct 23, 2008
    #17
  18. No idea. He was having a deep conversation with the salesperson.
    I *did* throw in that he would need to convert the RAWs as the
    camera had no in-body JPEG. (Which should tell you which
    camera it was.)

    But other than than, he was seriously considering the camera,
    holding it in the hand all the time ...

    -Wolfgang
     
    Wolfgang Weisselberg, Oct 24, 2008
    #18
  19. Mark Thomas

    Guest Guest

    that would be an sd9 or sd10.
    well they have sold some. not very many, but it is greater than zero.
     
    Guest, Oct 24, 2008
    #19
  20. Mark Thomas

    U*U Guest

    Next year Foveon will multiple the 4.6 by the bit depth....

    ;)
     
    U*U, Oct 25, 2008
    #20
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