small HDD

Discussion in 'Video Cameras' started by Mark H, Mar 30, 2006.

  1. Mark H

    Mark H Guest

    Hi,
    a basic question relating to Pinnacle Studio 8 which I've finally
    got round to using to put my mini DV on to DVD.

    I have a relatively small HDD which won't be enough for a full hours
    worth of DV material. Having looked at the manual it implies what I'm
    trying to do is a 3-step process, namely...

    1: capture/edit the material
    2: create / render the image
    3: burn it

    Given my disk limitations I'd like to know how simple / possible it is
    to capture / edit / generate smaller images and burn these collectively
    at the end.

    Any thoughts / pointers / links would be appreciated.


    Regards,


    Mark
     
    Mark H, Mar 30, 2006
    #1
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  2. Mark H

    John Russell Guest

    You could try capturing using a good quality DVD-video MPEG2 real time
    encoder, and then edit in MPEG2.

    Providing you capture at the bitrate you want for the DVD a decent editor
    shouldn't recompress the edited video. This isn't always the case as many
    compressors/editors try to make things easy by referring to high , middle or
    low compression, with say, high, not meaning the same at capture and
    rendering, thus producing recompression.
     
    John Russell, Mar 30, 2006
    #2
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  3. Mark H

    John Russell Guest

    You could try capturing using a good quality DVD-video MPEG2 real time
    encoder, and then edit in MPEG2.

    Providing you capture at the bitrate you want for the DVD a decent editor
    shouldn't recompress the edited video. This isn't always the case as many
    compressors/editors try to make things easy by referring to high , middle or
    low compression, with say, high, not meaning the same at capture and
    rendering, thus producing recompression.
     
    John Russell, Mar 30, 2006
    #3
  4. Mark H

    Tony Morgan Guest

    1. Select the Capture tab.
    2. On the Toolbar, select Setup/Capture Format, then from
    the Presets pulldown, select Preview.

    Though this will dramatically reduce the amount of disk-space on
    capture, the Make Movie process(es) will take considerably longer
    because the tape in your camcorder will shuttle backwards and forwards
    while making the movie after editing.

    If you've got USB on your computer, you might like to consider getting
    an external USB2 hard drive. Aldi do one which is very good. If you
    haven't currently got USB2 and it's a desktop computer, a USB2 card is
    relatively inexpensive.
     
    Tony Morgan, Mar 30, 2006
    #4
  5. Mark H

    Gaz Guest

    Exactly what I was about to suggest - a quick look on dabs.com and the
    first thing that pops up is a 250Gb USB2 HDD for less than 85 quid. I'm
    sure you could get one even cheaper by shopping around.
     
    Gaz, Mar 30, 2006
    #5
  6. Even better (IMHO) a FireWire disk (or a dual USB/FireWire). A few extra
    quids but more reliable, fast and lightweight.

    As we are talking of video editing, you must have a FireWire port already.

    Ciao,
    --
    Roberto Divia` Love at first sight is one of the greatest
    Dep:pH Bat:53 Mailbox:C02110 labour-saving devices the world has ever seen
    Route de Meyrin 385 ---------------------------------------------
    Case Postale Phone: +41-22-767-4994
    CH-1211 Geneve 23 CERN Fax: +41-22-767-9585
    Switzerland E-Mail:
     
    Roberto Divia, Mar 30, 2006
    #6
  7. Mark H

    :::Jerry:::: Guest

    If the OP is going down a road of adding / buying hardware don't you
    think it might be better to just add another HDD (and controller
    cards if needs be), rather than messing with USB2 - if he really has
    to have an external HDD then surely a Firewire version would be
    better than a USB?
     
    :::Jerry::::, Mar 30, 2006
    #7
  8. Mark H

    Tony Morgan Guest

    That is an option.
    If his firewire port is used for the external HDD, then where is he
    going to connect his camcorder?
     
    Tony Morgan, Mar 30, 2006
    #8
  9. On FireWire:

    1) standard controllers have two, three ports (it's the minimum, you must
    pay to get less). With two devices (DVCAM and HD) you can have each on
    its own FireWire link. Contrary to what happens on USB, FireWire
    independent chains attached on the same controller can and do work
    independently (see point 3).

    2) the camera uses a portion of the bandwidth - so called isochronous -
    that is *outside* the one used by asynchronous devices (disks, CDs, DVDs).
    Isochronous traffic has no arbitration, no handshake and no contention
    with other traffic. Therefore, disks and DVCAM do not interfere for
    what concerns bandwidth and arbitration, even when they belong to
    the same FireWire chain.

    3) A FireWire controller needs little or no control from the CPU: it
    works autonomously - up to a certain point, of course - and has some
    internal buffer space. USB, on the other hand, needs continuous control
    from the CPU.

    4) DVCAM traffic is (relatively) low bandwidth compared to HD traffic.
    Even less contention (HD traffic has to go at the same bandwidth as the
    DVCAM during the acquisition stage).

    I had a system with two DV-in, two disks and one DVD burner on one FireWire
    chain (for a test): zero problems for DV acquisition and for normal
    operation, including disk-to-disk and disk-to-DVD burner transfers.

    On the other hand, I had many problems to make the same disks working
    reliably on the same system using a USB2 port, even with all the
    other USB devices disconnected. Same system, different - obviously -
    controller. The problems I had included high CPU occupancy and lost
    disks (up to the point I had to reformat one of them). The same disks.

    If in doubt, search around the network: you'll find many comparative
    studies for disks over USB vs FireWire. They all come to the conclusion
    that at the peak USB2 is slightly faster and at the average FireWire
    faster and takes less CPU resources. You can ignore reports from
    manufacturers, if you think that they may be biased.

    I have yet to hear one FireWire HD user complain about unreliability or
    performance issues.

    Ciao,
    --
    Roberto Divia` Love at first sight is one of the greatest
    Dep:pH Bat:53 Mailbox:C02110 labour-saving devices the world has ever seen
    Route de Meyrin 385 ---------------------------------------------
    Case Postale Phone: +41-22-767-4994
    CH-1211 Geneve 23 CERN Fax: +41-22-767-9585
    Switzerland E-Mail:
     
    Roberto Divia, Mar 30, 2006
    #9
  10. Mark H

    :::Jerry:::: Guest

    To another port? Many MB's and 99 percent of Firewire cards have more
    than one port, it's possible that one port it rear mounted and the
    second is front mounted.

    For a system not to have the above would mean that it is more than a
    few years old, if so there might be other issues, perhaps the OP
    would post a brief outline of his system spec.
     
    :::Jerry::::, Mar 30, 2006
    #10
  11. Mark H

    RobDee Guest

    Back in ye olde days when I edited on a budget, I had a few external
    firewire HDD's - all of which had 2 extra firewire ports incorporated and
    all of which worked flawlessly in shuttling video both between each other
    and while capturing from camera. Not a dropped frame even with 3 HDDs in a
    chain with the Camera at the end of the same chain!

    Rob
     
    RobDee, Mar 30, 2006
    #11


  12. Many firewire drives have daisy chain ports .... so he'd connect it to
    the spare port on the drive !

    An example might be (if he had a Mac Mini) a matching IOMega drive :
    http://www.iomega-europe.com/eu/products.aspx?productId=MiniMax_250GB
    comes with 3-port FW hub.

    Cheers - Neil
     
    Neil Smith [MVP Digital Media], Mar 30, 2006
    #12
  13. Mark H

    Ed Chilada Guest

    For what reason?

    USB2 is (marginally) faster than firewire.
     
    Ed Chilada, Apr 1, 2006
    #13
  14. Mark H

    Tony Morgan Guest

    USB2 has a speed step-down mechanism - firewire does not. It's not
    unusual for USB2 to operate at less than optimum (maximum) speed.

    Having said that, I still think the a USB2 external disk drive is better
    - if for no other reason than relatively few PCs (and especially
    notebooks) have more than one firewire port. And yes, I do know that you
    can add a multi-port firewire card to a PC.
     
    Tony Morgan, Apr 1, 2006
    #14
  15. Peak: yes. In real life - according to the majority of the reports available
    on the 'net - no.

    Ciao,
    --
    Roberto Divia` Love at first sight is one of the greatest
    Dep:pH Bat:53 Mailbox:C02110 labour-saving devices the world has ever seen
    Route de Meyrin 385 ---------------------------------------------
    Case Postale Phone: +41-22-767-4994
    CH-1211 Geneve 23 CERN Fax: +41-22-767-9585
    Switzerland E-Mail:
     
    Roberto Divia, Apr 3, 2006
    #15
  16. Mark H

    G Hardy Guest

    Not only that - some USB2 hubs work at the speed of the slowest connected
    device.

    In fact - high-speed USB seems to me to be a hit-and-miss affair. From
    another list I'm on:
    "I have one mobo with three USB controllers, two 1.1 and one 2.0. In order
    to get USB 2.0 speeds you have to either fill four of the ports with active
    devices, then the fifth operates at 2.0 or, you can shut off the two 1.1
    controllers in BIOS (which in turn limits the number of devices you can
    connect). I think somebody had too many betel nuts the day this was thought
    out."

    An explanation of the reference to 'betel nuts' is unlikely to help in this
    context. :eek:)
     
    G Hardy, Apr 3, 2006
    #16
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