We don' need no stiinkin' Kodachrome. We got jets, man, we got jets.

Discussion in '35mm Cameras' started by Nicholas O. Lindan, Apr 25, 2007.

  1. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Paul Furman Guest

    Whew, cutting out the sprocket holes with a knife!
    Funny that it's presented as compressed digital video with a soundtrack
    of a super-8 projector :)
     
    Paul Furman, Apr 27, 2007
    #21
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  2. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Pieter Guest

    The thread below reminds me of some ancient history...

    I had one of the stranger film recorder setups that sort of bridged the gap
    between the very old corporate graphics and the entirely electronic. In
    fact it only lasted for a couple of years before technology made it
    obsolete.

    Polaroid use to make a 35 mm film recorder, and, of course, relatively
    instant slide film. As I recall, the film still needed processing, but it
    could be done on the spot at home or office. So I would use "corporate
    graphics" software to create a PowerPoint-like set of charts, graphs, and
    text slides, then use the film recorder to transfer them from screen to 35mm
    slides. Put them in the carousel and hit the road. This could be done
    overnight, which (at the time) was almost mind bending speed. In fact, I
    did this as a second job for a couple of years. With the advent of the
    digital projector I and my Polaroid film recorder became obsolete.
    Eventually it went in the trash (and I'm getting there too).

    Here's another sad bit of history. I threw out an almost new HP 7475 6 pen
    plotter a year or so ago. Remember them? The only way to print decent
    graphics before there was an inkjet printer. Since there are no cureent
    driver, and nobody interested, there was no interest, even for free, in this
    (originally) expensive plotter. Almost new in the original box complete
    with manuals and DOS software. No interest at all.

    Now where's that old US Robotics 300 baud modem........


    I've been in the computer business a LONG time. Before video projectors
    (and PowerPoint for that matter) business presentations were done with
    Kodak Carousels. So much so, it was assumed there would be a projector
    at your destination; you didn't have to bring one.

    When these new-fangled "digital images" became available, the film
    recorder was born; they'd "print" the images onto 35mm Ektachrome. With
    well done subject material, the results were quite impressive, but the
    devices were a bit pricey; I recall them starting at about $6,000 in
    late 80's dollars.[/QUOTE]
     
    Pieter, Apr 28, 2007
    #22
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  3. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Rob Morley Guest

    I remember spending a weekend producing a load of OHP transparencies for
    my SIL many years ago using a 4 pen plotter when her art department
    missed their deadline. I can't remember what the software was but it
    was distinctly non-WYSIWYG, ISTR it was running via dumb terminal with
    an acoustically coupled modem. Try telling that to kids these days and
    they won't believe you. :)
     
    Rob Morley, Apr 28, 2007
    #23
  4. Hey, that's a state of the art ... it wasn't _that_ long ago ... oh, yeah, I
    guess it was. Should I throw my Polaroid processor out, do you think? The
    slide mounter thingy is good for cutting up film into strips.
    I have a Calcomp 1043GT [e-size (36x48") 8-pen plotter, india ink &
    rapidograph points] sitting in the basement next to the furnace.
    Every now and then I clean the mouse nests out of it. I don't
    know if it works. It's been 15 years since I gave it any 120V so
    it's in deep hibernation. But I _can't_ put it out on the curb.
     
    Nicholas O. Lindan, Apr 28, 2007
    #24
  5. In my closet, right next to the 1200, 2400, 9600, 28.8K, 56K...

    I remember just loving 300 baud 'cause it could throw text across my IBM PC
    green screen* at just about the same speed I could read it. What more could
    we ever need??

    A month ago we went to 8 Mbps cable with a shiny new "cable modem" (actually
    a network bridge). 60 MB file downloads in 60 seconds. What more could we
    ever need??

    Uh oh... I see our telephone service provider Verizon is now rolling out
    FiOS at up to 50 Mbps. 60 MB file downloads in 9.6 seconds. Better make
    some more room in that closet??

    Ken

    * All of my Windows Command Prompt console sessions since that time have
    always been configured to render green-on-black text in honor of that
    original IBM PC system.
     
    Ken Nadvornick, Apr 28, 2007
    #25
  6. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Alan Browne Guest

    Videotron is test-deploying 100 MBps cable modems in Montreal now.
    Ready for market in 2008. (Will roll out at 50 Mbps with 100 as an
    "upgrade").
     
    Alan Browne, Apr 28, 2007
    #26
  7. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Pieter Guest

    yup - been there, done that. I used to have to PROGRAM the graphics
    shapes - of course a hatch inside a border could be done in 1 statement, but
    you had to program each grap in its entirety. I though that a program that
    let you set up the plot on screen and then send it to a plotter was a huge
    step forward - who could ask fo anything more? And why would we ever want
    more the 64K RAM (or maybe 256K RAM)......
     
    Pieter, Apr 28, 2007
    #27
  8. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Pieter Guest

    Welcome to the plotter generation support group.........we don't shuffle, we
    plot.........

     
    Pieter, Apr 28, 2007
    #28
  9. Heh, heh...

    How soon before the rate-determining step becomes the computer system's
    internal bus? (OK, maybe not. But you get the drift.)

    100 Mbps? Hell, that's Fast Ethernet. I wonder how many content providers
    can keep up? Try downloading the QT "Creamer.mov" movie file referenced by
    Jim in his OT post above. Pretty sad...

    (But fascinating nevertheless -- especially when he sets fire to his
    scanner...)

    Ken
     
    Ken Nadvornick, Apr 28, 2007
    #29
  10. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Pieter Guest

    I had (honestly - you might remember this) a US Robotics 300 baud "auto dial
    " modem. WOW!! Turns out, you had to write assembler or (better yet)
    basic with in-line assembler to get it to dial a number!! How's that for
    auto-dial? It was a couple of boxes of parts. It had a big old relay to do
    a pulse dial with, and as it clunked along, so did a green LED on the modem.
    I had a callable routine loaded into high memory on my old TRS-80 that I
    could call from Basic and pass the phone number as a parameter. I was a God
    of Z-80 assembler! But who cares now?

    I like the idea of green on black. And likely it woun't give you a brain
    tumor like those 3270 terminals.....

    Needless to say, that one went to the land of bad parts a long time ago...
     
    Pieter, Apr 28, 2007
    #30
  11. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Pieter Guest

    Hey - I just looked at using a 802.11N wireless router. Now I know why
    anyone cares about router speed!

    I used to "network" with parallel ports and LANTasic software. Small file
    transfers across the room were a slow adventure.

    Boy this whole thread is a trip down memory lane!


     
    Pieter, Apr 28, 2007
    #31
  12. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Alan Browne Guest

    Whenever I believe that the memory in my PC is enough; that the harddisk
    is big enough; that the CPU is fast enough; that my connection is fast
    enough ... they all get superseded and software seems to bloat continuously.

    Actually, I've had two "downgrades" in numbers:
    -Nikon 9000 ED @ 4000 dpi (v. my sold Minolta 5400 dpi) scanner.

    -AMD 64 Athlon Dual Core @2.2 GHz (v. my former WinXP box, now Linux box
    at 2.4 GHz Celeron). The Dual core is at least 4x faster when scanning
    with ICE on. (on the Minolta 5400 an ICE scan at 5400 took 12 - 14
    minutes on the 2.4 GHz Celeron; on the "slower" Dual core it took 3 - 4
    minutes).

    ....and to think I once thought a 40 MB hard disk was all the memory in
    the world. Pre-windblows of course...

    For now there's nothing that justifies anything faster than my 5 Mbps
    cable modem. The largest DLs I ever did were Linux distros ... took
    about 90 minutes. DLing Elements 3 took about 20 minutes IIRC. But
    these are 1 or 2 events per year so a faster DL is not a necessity at all.

    Cheers,
    Alan
     
    Alan Browne, Apr 28, 2007
    #32
  13. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Alan Browne Guest

    Pls don't top post.
     
    Alan Browne, Apr 28, 2007
    #33
  14. Nicholas O. Lindan

    Ken Hart Guest

    Alright, enough of you young whippersnappers!

    I learned FOCAL programming on a Digital PDP-8 (at school, not my own
    machine!), with 4K of magnetic core memory. To boot-up, we toggled the front
    panel switched to enter enough 1's and 0's so that the computer would
    recognize the punched paper tape reader. Then we could load a paper tape to
    boot the computer enough to read the '33 teletype unit.

    My first computer was a Radio Shack TRS-80 Model 3, with 16K of RAM. I had a
    150 baud modem to connect to bulletin board systems. Next machine was a
    TRS-80 Model 4 (48K RAM). I eventually added 5" floppy drives to these
    machines to replace the cassette tape storage.

    My first laptop was the Radio Shack model 100, with a 40 character wide, 8
    line high display.

    My first PC was a no-name, DIY with a 10Meg hard drive. These machines are
    all either landfill, closet-fill, or listings on "vintage" section of eBay;
    I've gotten rid of them long ago.

    Then there came WIndows....
    and now no amount of RAM or hard drive or connection speed is enough!
     
    Ken Hart, Apr 28, 2007
    #34
  15. Alan Browne spake thus:
    That's why if there were any justice in the world, if there were a god,
    then programmers would be forced to work on the *slowest* computers with
    the *least* amount of memory and storage. The way things are now, they
    get fancy, fast and humungous-storage machines, then assume that the
    rest of the world has the same setup to run their morbidly obese code ...


    --
    Any system of knowledge that is capable of listing films in order
    of use of the word "****" is incapable of writing a good summary
    and analysis of the Philippine-American War. And vice-versa.
    This is an inviolable rule.

    - Matthew White, referring to Wikipedia on his WikiWatch site
    (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/wikiwoo.htm)
     
    David Nebenzahl, Apr 29, 2007
    #35
  16. Pieter spake thus:
    I still think the Z-80 is one of the coolest machines ever invented.
    Like that neato-keeno "context switch" that would instantly swap two
    sets of registers; that was really something for the 1980s.
    (Unfortunately, I never got to write any code for that chip.)


    --
    Any system of knowledge that is capable of listing films in order
    of use of the word "****" is incapable of writing a good summary
    and analysis of the Philippine-American War. And vice-versa.
    This is an inviolable rule.

    - Matthew White, referring to Wikipedia on his WikiWatch site
    (http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/wikiwoo.htm)
     
    David Nebenzahl, Apr 29, 2007
    #36
  17. That was a good line 10 years ago, but nowadays most of my disc space
    is gobbled up by photographs I've taken myself, and I have no
    programmers to blame.
     
    Toni Nikkanen, Apr 29, 2007
    #37
  18. There is, of course. His name is Bill and he lives on the lake shore in
    Medina...
    I well remember sitting at my desk with my small booklet of Intel x86
    mnemonic opcodes, counting CPU clock cycles to decide if it was faster to
    code three inline 'movsb' instructions, or loop through a single one using
    the CX register.

    Not much call these days for such thoughtful efficiencies...

    I think I remember reading somewhere that the Voyager spacecraft's computers
    were each built around core memory modules of 4KB -- or something equally
    amazing.

    Imagine that... successfully exploring the entire solar system (with
    *photos*!) on a handful of KBs of memory and a tape drive storage unit. And
    continuing to do so thirty years later today.

    So how many GBs does it take these days just to install MS Office so I can
    type "Hello world?"

    Ken
     
    Ken Nadvornick, Apr 29, 2007
    #38
  19. I have one in use for OTP programming legacy systems. I
    used an old hp Vectra till that gave up the ghost.

    And I know someone who refuses to give up
    pfs Write on an XT ... something with being 95.

    My first pdp experience was an 8E.
     
    Nicholas O. Lindan, Apr 29, 2007
    #39
  20. But you aren't requiring anyone else to put your 100gB of
    photos on _their_ disks.

    Reporter: "IBM has just announced it's 1952 computer will have
    8,000 words of memory. What are people going to do
    with all that memory?"

    Grace Hopper: "Waste it."
     
    Nicholas O. Lindan, Apr 29, 2007
    #40
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