Wedding Pictures

Discussion in 'Photography' started by Borked Pseudo Mailed, Aug 11, 2008.

  1. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Guest Guest

    Spoken like a truly inexperienced photographer. I have photographed in many
    places where it is not an option to use flash, what would you do in this
    Guest, Aug 16, 2008
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  2. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Vance Guest

    I agree in the main with using the lowest ISO that will get the image
    and always gong for the highest in camera image you can produce.
    Where I part company is with the Universal Qualifier 'always.' I hold
    the position that after a certain level of skill is reached by either
    a pro or an amateur, the 'musts' and 'always' of photography are
    guidelines that are pretty much adhered to, but the photographer can
    ignore at will if that is the creative choice they want to make. I
    don't advocate sloppy technique, or the slavish following of rules
    past a certain level of mastery.

    Your right, we can add noise digitally and I do. However, that's not
    exactly the same as the noise you get from a high ISO. It's more like
    film grain, which is inherent and more or less homogenous across the
    frame. There is more noise in the lower tones than there is in the
    higher tones with digital. In certain images, this can contribute to
    a look that is qualitatively different from just adding noise without
    going to the trouble of creating graduated masks for non-contiguous
    areas to produce similar results. Again, though, this is in the
    context of a conscious choice made to achieve an artistic goal.

    You are partially right about removing noise. In an absolute sense,
    only a certain amount of noise can be reduced and it will tend to
    degrade the image. However, pragmatically a lot can be done to reduce
    the amount of noticeable noise without having a practical effect on
    the final product. It depends very much on the subject and the
    customers standards. I know a couple of portrait photographers whose
    dirty little secret for shooting women is to use noise reduction
    software instead of the more obvious soft lens or the more common post
    process beautifiers.

    Vance, Aug 17, 2008
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  3. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Joel Guest

    When talking about Wedding, most people don't always talk about formal but
    the whole ceremony in general. IOW, flash should be allowed for formal, and
    some churches allow limited flash during wedding ceremony which you need to
    ask for permission first.
    Joel, Aug 18, 2008
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    Guest Guest

    Where I come from (England) we don't have such a relaxed attitude to
    photography and if you are photographing in a 'high' church (Church of
    England) they don't allow photography of any kind during the ceremony. Other
    religions are more relaxed, Catholic, Jewish, Orthodox Christians, Muslim
    are all very accommodating. Imagine you are a bride and you want to have
    your wedding in a C of E church, my advice is don't bother.
    Guest, Aug 18, 2008
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    Peter Guest

    The reason for this is because there are more pixels per unit at the higher
    end. So the lower tones require a higher degree of interpolation.
    This is one of the reasons I try to shoot so that my histogram is as far to
    the right as I can get it, without blowing the highlights.
    Peter, Aug 19, 2008
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    Joel Guest

    Very possible and especially some like cathedral then they may have some
    special rule. And in general, most church won't allow using flash during
    ceremony, *but* some allows because wedding. funeral, baptism etc. can be
    consider private family ceremony (or some like that).

    But sometime it can be exceptional like the wedding of the price/princess,
    or some special ceremony then they may allow few professional(s).

    Also, the lighting of wedding isn't too bad comparing to funeral which
    they usually have the pretty dim light, but the emotion can't be beaten. I
    am more of a closeup photographer so I like photograph funeral more than
    wedding (but love the bribes as they usually in their best mood and the good
    make up makes a hude difference etc..).
    Joel, Aug 19, 2008
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    Guest Guest

    What method do you use to get a picture of a black box against a black
    background? Surely the correct placement for this subject would be on the
    left of the histogram.
    Guest, Aug 19, 2008
  8. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    jimkramer Guest

    jimkramer, Aug 19, 2008
  9. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Peter Guest

    Since you obviously know so much more than I:
    Are you saying that with a Bayer pattern the total number of green sensitive
    pixels are not equal to the total number of red and blue?
    If you are not saying that, please explain in simple English how 18% gray
    (equal red, green & blue,) is obtained and why we have artifacts and color
    Or, please give some other understandable explanation.
    If you cannot come up with an alternate explanation, do not mock what you
    don't understand.
    I look forward to learning from you and am waiting for your response.
    Peter, Aug 22, 2008
  10. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Vance Guest

    Vance, Aug 23, 2008
  11. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    jimkramer Guest

    jimkramer, Aug 23, 2008
  12. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Paul Furman Guest

    That's a good explanation, I'll try to add to it. Sorry about my smart
    ass comment, I was just having fun.

    Green is weighted more heavily for figuring the gray scale lightness of
    a given pixel when interpolating from bayer so it's still very useful in
    capturing non-color detail. People can distinguish an incredible variety
    of subtle green color variations: I used to do colored pencil drawings
    for landscape architectural renderings and there's a bunch of green
    pencils available but still never enough to get just the variation
    you're looking for. It must be an evolutionary thing surviving in a
    mostly green world.

    Sensor bloom is very rarely if ever the reason for color fringing,
    that's an old misconception. It has to do with chromatic aberration (CA)
    or the mis-focusing of the different wavelengths of light and getting
    them all to match. Only very expensive lenses are completely free of CA
    and while P&S lenses are fantastic for their size, their purpose for
    existing is low cost so you don't see scientific grade optics in them
    and some CA is always a factor.

    Paul Furman

    all google groups messages filtered due to spam
    Paul Furman, Aug 23, 2008
  13. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Guest Guest

    It doesn't bother the Catholics and they are quite religious. We don't have
    pre wedding 'formals' here, all the pictures are taken in real time in a
    social documentary style, more like a news event.
    Guest, Aug 24, 2008
  14. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Vance Guest

    Here in the US, a 'style' being called photojournalistic is very
    popular and becoming more so. There are several wedding photographers
    that I shoot the photojournalistic component for. I am moving out of
    photojournalism since it's a bad market. While there is a big
    difference between shooting in a 'social documentary style/
    photojournalistic' visual style and shooting from the perspective of a
    documentary or photojournalism photographer, I wouldn't use the term
    'amateur hour' for either one.

    I cover a wedding very much as a photo essay because that is my
    approach. The photographers who I work with are all very capable
    classic wedding photographers and can produce great pictures in a
    casual style, but they aren't quite as good as I am at producing a
    coherent visual story. The customers like the result of having all
    the classical images that are associated with wedding photography and
    the 'backstory', if you will, of my coverage. It is what the market
    here seems to want and, because it isn't 'amateur hour', we deliver.

    I'm getting the impression that everyone seems to shoot the formals
    before the ceremony. Maybe it's just a West Coast thing in the US and
    maybe just California, but we generally shoot all the formals after
    the ceremony. Interesting.

    Vance, Aug 24, 2008
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    tony cooper Guest

    Speaking as the father of the bride, and not as a photographer, we
    hired a photographer for my daughter's (Catholic) wedding. We
    instructed the photographer not to shoot at all during the ceremony.
    Pictures were taken before and after, but not during.

    We weren't concerned about the "quite religious" aspects, but we were
    thinking of the distraction aspect. It just didn't seem right to have
    someone roaming the aisles firing off a camera. It was a wedding, not
    a media event.

    There were some guests who took photographs, and some flash shots,
    during the ceremony. That was fine with us. The guests were friends,
    and we were not about to restrict what our friends did.

    The wedding was almost eight years ago, and neither my wife and I nor
    my daughter and her husband feel deprived because there are no
    photographs in the album that were taken during the ceremony.

    I think that any "rules" about photography during the ceremony should
    be the exclusive and absolute decision of the bride and her family.
    (The groom doesn't count. No one pays any attention to the groom at
    any wedding.)

    The wedding was in Jacksonville Beach, Florida, by the way. The best
    photographs in the album are the goofy shots of the bridal party on
    the beach after the ceremony. The photographer got some great candids
    that show personality. If we had those shots, plus one formal shot of
    the bride and groom in full wedding regalia, that would be sufficient
    for an album. The cake cutting, the hands with rings, the first
    dance, the dance with the father-of-the-bride...all that stuff is just
    too trite to care about.

    A comment complete aside from the topic: I am proud to say that
    neither my daughter nor my son-in-law smashed a slice of the wedding
    cake into the other's face. That has to be the most stupid
    "tradition" to ever be adopted at weddings/receptions.
    tony cooper, Aug 24, 2008
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    tony cooper Guest

    A "professional" is one who is paid for his/her services. Charging
    for his/her services does not imbue any sense in a photographer. I've
    been to weddings with professionals who did roam the aisles. The
    worst offenders are the video tapers.

    Assuming that the photographer will remain in the choir loft is not a
    good thing to do. The organizer of the wedding should make it clear
    to the photographer what the boundaries are.

    Didn't say it was a photographer-suggested action. The couple seem to
    decide to do this or not to do it. I think it shows latent hostility.
    tony cooper, Aug 24, 2008
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    Guest Guest

    On the contrary, it's bloody difficult.
    Guest, Aug 24, 2008
  18. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Guest Guest

    That wouldn't go down well at the Ritz.
    Guest, Aug 24, 2008
  19. Borked Pseudo Mailed

    Vance Guest

    Many styles don't stand the test of time. For one thing, advancements
    in technology often result in changes of style. The advent of small
    format cameras, flash technology that didn't threaten to blow
    everything to hell and gone, roll film, color photography, etc. With
    the changes in technology have been their application in ways that
    were cool for awhile because they had that gee whiz factor, but went
    by the wayside. Others, such as the use of ring flash come and go as
    new generations discover it and then it is new again. That's the way
    of things. However, I am not in the business of producing timeless
    images. I'm in the business of meeting my customers desires with the
    highest quality I can at a price they will pay. It's crass, I know,
    but it pays the rent and buys the equipment.
    We shoot the formals after since everyone who needs to be there will
    be there and they generally don't seem too hagard. In fact, they seem
    more relaxed becuase the big show is over. It also makes sense to do
    it after because the lessor guests (non relatives, the ones you don't
    have to get an image of) can go on to the reception and when the B&G
    show up, they get to make an entrance after all the guests have
    settled down and things are going smoothly. I don't make the decision
    on that. Whoever is shooting the formals does and they seem to like
    shooting post ceremony.

    Vance, Aug 24, 2008
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    Peter Guest

    Sounds like you and your familoy have a well balanced attitude towards those
    matters and a sense of what is really imoporant.

    Peter, Aug 25, 2008
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