What you see is always quite what gets you:

Discussion in 'Digital Cameras' started by Eric Stevens, Sep 9, 2013.

  1. Train-speed can be deceptive (as can be its position, if using
    a wide-angle or tele lens...;-) And, people don't think about
    how different stopping a train is from stopping road-vehicles.
    Near where I used to live on a cliff overlooking a large lake,
    a railroad runs between the base of the cliff and the lake. I
    (and many other people) used the tracks as a way to walk along
    the lake and cliff-bottom. The trains that use this long single
    dead-end track service both a coal-fired power station and a
    salt mine many miles up the lake, and it often has 100 cars,
    half of them loaded either with coal or with salt (both heavy).
    Even though when the train passed beneath my house, it would
    shake the house and was quite audible, when walking on the track
    facing away from the approaching train, it was not audible and
    was not felt until the engineer blew the horn - and a few times
    when this happened, I was surprised how close it was! It went
    only about 5mph in the area where I walked, but the difficulty
    in stopping this train even at this slow speed became evident
    further down the track one day when a bus was struck crossing
    the track and dragged sideways about 100'. The train was much
    closer than that to me the times I heard its horn...

    [Oh-oh - it looks like I may be becoming one of those annoying
    people who, having just discovered a newsgroup, jumps in and
    "plasters" it with a bunch of posts in old topics...;-]

    --DR
     
    David Ruether, Sep 14, 2013
    #41
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  2. Eric Stevens

    George Kerby Guest

    Yet his other senses did not allow for knowledge of danger? Earth rumbling
    under his feet, vibration of the air ahead of large moving object, hearing
    of the nearby noise? Huh!
     
    George Kerby, Sep 14, 2013
    #42
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  3. Eric Stevens

    Frank S Guest

    Frank S, Sep 14, 2013
    #43
  4. Eric Stevens

    PeterN Guest

    O gauge, I think. No it is not as OOF as you think. It is probably more
    OOF than you think.
    I was at the annual train show at the NYBG. Th train was moving, I was
    not using an AF lens, the light was low, and a security guard started
    giving me grief about having my camera too close to the moving train,
    and right on the track. (whatca gonna do.) If I go to the train show
    this year, I will try for at least one sharp image.
     
    PeterN, Sep 15, 2013
    #44
  5. and that's a diesel locomotive, which in the best case can't go faster than
    130km/h.when I last went to Germany, in 1993, in a holiday work camp. there
    was just the ICE train (InterCityExpress) which could go 200 km/h. its
    features were really amazing, full electronic inverter drive (3-phase
    asynchronous squirrel cage motors), 13,000 HP in 2 locomotives, 1-100 km/h
    acceleration in 10 sec, 12 cars, full-aircondition (totally sealed, even the
    toilets are like the aircraft ones), excellent insulation, the dream of an
    engineer. Now, when one is approaching your station, you can hear a rumbling
    like thunder, the catenary begins to shake, and then ocmes the train with a
    terrible noise.there were white lines on the platforms through which ICE
    trains were passing which you weren't allowed to cross.last but not least,
    catenary in germany is 15kv, 16 2/3 Hz, with their own power stations. And
    to stay on topic, I have a couple of nice slides of german trains (the 111
    E-Lok [electric locomotive], IMHO these are the *real* electric vehicles,
    not those electric cars they are trying to revive, and an ICE passing at
    full speed on a curve under a bridge. In the next days, if I have money, I
    will digitize these 2 slides and post them on flickr.
     
    Tzortzakakis Dimitrios, Sep 15, 2013
    #45
  6. I wrote all that babble and I forgot the most important point:I wouldn't
    dare stading in front of any vehicle with enough mass to kill me, even if it
    was moving with 1km/h. and as we learned in Lykeion (the greek high school)
    if your mass m1<<m2 (if your mass is unsiginificant to the oncoming vehicle)
    then U1=2*U2!!That means if an ICE hits you, you will fly with a speed of
    400km/h (and you'll be minced, goes without saying)
    Just my 2 cents...
     
    Tzortzakakis Dimitrios, Sep 15, 2013
    #46
  7. Eric Stevens

    Eric Stevens Guest

    He would have heard. He appears to have misjudged.
     
    Eric Stevens, Sep 16, 2013
    #47
  8. Eric Stevens

    PhotoPhartz Guest

    The article I read, which is the one linked at the start of the thread,
    also said: "One witness was reported yesterday as saying he appeared to be
    busy looking at the screen on his camera."

    Might be irrelavant but then facts often are in these usenet "discussions".

    Carry on.
     
    PhotoPhartz, Sep 17, 2013
    #48
  9. Eric Stevens

    Savageduck Guest

    ....and yet, Alfred argues that the victim had to be locked into tunnel
    vision through an optical viewfinder. I contend that the camera type
    was not established. What we have from the witness is also subject to
    interpretation. Knowing the type of camera used would remove all debate.
     
    Savageduck, Sep 17, 2013
    #49
  10. Eric Stevens

    Tony Cooper Guest

    I really can't buy this...that the type of camera would shed any light
    on why the guy didn't notice a fucking huge train bearing down on him.
    I don't care if he was using some antique cameras where the
    photographer crouched under a cloth and held up a powder flash device;
    he'd still be aware of a train.

    I think the guy simply misjudged where he was in relation to the
    oncoming train and wasn't thinking. Either that, or he was trying to
    win a Darwin Award.

    Don't blame the camera.
     
    Tony Cooper, Sep 18, 2013
    #50
  11. Eric Stevens

    Savageduck Guest

    Alfred contended that the victim had misjudged distance because he was
    looking through an optical viewfinder. I said that was an assumption
    which could only be made if we knew the type of camera used, and that
    the approaching train could well have been framed on an LCD screen, or
    an OVF. I have no idea which. I have no idea what distracted him, or
    caused such a serious fixation that he let the train hit him. I could
    only claim to know if an OVF or LCD screen played a part in this
    incredibly dumb accident if we had some idea of the type of camera
    used. We don't, and I was just pointing this out to Alfred who seems to
    have some inside knowledge of the dead photographer's technique for
    shooting approaching locomotives.

    Hell! For all I know this guy might have decided that it was a good day
    to commit suicide. People do that.
    Yup! All of those.
    I don't blame the camera, I believe the photographer was responsible
    for his fate.
     
    Savageduck, Sep 18, 2013
    #51
  12. Eric Stevens

    Tony Cooper Guest

    A guy here in town tried to commit suicide-by-cop recently. He
    charged a cop waving a gun, the cop fired a Taser instead of his
    sidearm, and the gun-waver's gun went off and wounded a bystander.
     
    Tony Cooper, Sep 18, 2013
    #52
  13. Eric Stevens

    Savageduck Guest

    Sometimes cops have to make life & death decisions. Don't envy that
    responsibility when faced with those choices.
     
    Savageduck, Sep 18, 2013
    #53
  14. Eric Stevens

    J. Clarke Guest

    Not necessarily. Having an optical finder does not obligate one to use
    it.
     
    J. Clarke, Sep 18, 2013
    #54
  15. Eric Stevens

    Guest Guest

    and many times they get it wrong.

    here's one from just a couple of days ago:
    <http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/16/charlotte-north-carolina-c
    ar-crash-victim-shot>
    An unarmed man seeking help after a car crash over the weekend was
    shot 10 times by the Charlotte police officer who's now charged in
    his death, investigators said Monday.

    12 shots, with 10 hitting him, all when the guy was unarmed? that's
    not self-defense, that's cold blooded murder.
     
    Guest, Sep 18, 2013
    #55
  16. Eric Stevens

    George Kerby Guest

    He was a black guy in a Lilly white 'Burb...
     
    George Kerby, Sep 18, 2013
    #56
  17. Eric Stevens

    Alfred Molon Guest

    Alfred Molon, Sep 18, 2013
    #57
  18. Eric Stevens

    Savageduck Guest

    Implication is not fact.

    Viewfinder, LCD, or any other distraction, standing on a track in the
    path of an oncoming locomotive is not a particularly bright move.
     
    Savageduck, Sep 18, 2013
    #58
  19. Eric Stevens

    PeterN Guest

    On 9/17/2013 6:06 PM, Savageduck wrote:

    Yet the type of camera might be irrelevant. There are times when I am so
    concentrated on a task, that I lose all perspective aout
     
    PeterN, Sep 18, 2013
    #59
  20. Eric Stevens

    PeterN Guest

    On 9/17/2013 7:56 PM, Tony Cooper wrote:

    Proving that an unsigned waiver is not valid
     
    PeterN, Sep 18, 2013
    #60
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