What's your favorite all-purpose lens?

Discussion in '35mm Cameras' started by dickr2, Nov 29, 2010.

  1. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    : Savageduck wrote:
    : > On 2010-12-09 23:47:38 -0800, "Bill Graham" <> said:
    : >
    : >> Savageduck wrote:
    : >>> On 2010-12-09 17:11:19 -0800, "Bill Graham" <> said:
    : >>>
    : >>>> Robert Coe wrote:
    : >>>>> On Tue, 07 Dec 2010 19:43:48 -0800, David Nebenzahl
    : >>>>>> On 12/7/2010 6:29 PM Bill Graham spake thus:
    : >>>>>>
    : >>>>>>> David Nebenzahl wrote:
    : >>>>>>>
    : >>>>>>>> On 12/5/2010 11:10 PM Bill Graham spake thus:
    : >>>>>>>>
    : >>>>>>>>> There was an episode on "Forensic Files" where a guy cut up a
    : >>>>>>>>> floppy disc with a pair of pinking shears, and one of the cops
    : >>>>>>>>> was able to put it back together with a special extra thin
    : >>>>>>>>> scotch tape and actually read it into his computer. This is a
    : >>>>>>>>> true story, because I talked to the guy's son via email, and
    : >>>>>>>>> he verified it.
    : >>>>>>>>
    : >>>>>>>> Bullshit. Can't be done.
    : >>>>>>>>
    : >>>>>>>> Man, you *are* gullible.
    : >>>>>>>
    : >>>>>>> Bullshit. It can, and was done. Forensic files is based on true
    : >>>>>>> police episodes, and this took place on an army base in the
    : >>>>>>> Phillipeans. Its not that I'm gullable. It's that you are very
    : >>>>>>> stupid.
    : >>>>>>
    : >>>>>> "Phillipeans"? What's that?
    : >>>>>
    : >>>>> Obsequious words of praise to a guy named Phillip.
    : >>>>>
    : >>>>> Bob
    : >>>>
    : >>>> "Philippines" was the spelling before they came up with
    : >>>> "Filippines". Showing results for philippines. Search instead for
    : >>>> filippines
    : >>>
    : >>> Filipinos are the nationals of The Philippines (named for Phil II of
    : >>> Spain), there never was a "Filippines". The "F" in "Filipinos" is
    : >>> derived from "Filipe".
    : >>> Filipino is the language of the Filipinos, who call call their
    : >>> country "Republika ng Pilipinas".
    : >>>
    : >>> I think you missed the point of Bill's misspelling, and Bob's
    : >>> tongue-in-cheek comment regarding "Phillipeans".
    : >>
    : >> Well, not trying to start an argument (God knows I wouldn't do that)
    : >> it still doesn't make sense to me. If the name of the country is,
    : >> "Philippines", then it seems to me that its people should be called,
    : >> "Philippenos". Substituting an F for the Ph when writing in the same
    : >> language, (English) doesn't make sense to me. If the country is
    : >> "England" why would you want to call its people "Inglishmen"?
    : >
    : > Actually, that one is more confusing than you might think.
    : > Technically the country, part of which lends its name to the language
    : > "English", is The United Kingdom and is also known as Great Britain.
    : > So why are those folks from England, Scotland, Wales, & (Northern)
    : > Ireland, not "Ukers". The Scots, Catholic Northern-Irish, and Welch
    : > resent being called, or even though of as British, and they are
    : > supposed to be a "United Kingdom". What's up with that Bill?
    : >
    : > Why would you call citizens of The Netherlands, also known as
    : > Holland, "Dutch"?
    : > Then the folks who come from Denmark are Danes, who speak Danish,
    : > ain't that great, and the danish you eat doesn't come from Denmark.
    : >
    : > Isn't it amazing what some of us "UnifiedStaters" can come up with?
    : > :)
    :
    : Yes, but (you knew that was coming) its just the substitution of the "F" for
    : the "Ph" when you go from the name of the country to the name of its
    : inhabitants that I don't understand. Holland and Dutch are two seperate
    : names altogether. So is England and United Kingdom. But Philippines and
    : Filippinos are basically the same word, from the same root. Why the change
    : in the first letters?

    You have to remember that both English (inglés) and Spanish (espanñol) have
    been widely spoken in the Phillipines. Spellings with "Ph" and a double "l"
    are based on English; spellings with "F" and a single "l" are based on
    Spanish.

    Bob (Roberto)
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 10, 2010
    #61
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  2. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    : Savageduck wrote:
    : >
    : > Actually, that one is more confusing than you might think.
    : > Technically the country, part of which lends its name to the language
    : > "English", is The United Kingdom and is also known as Great Britain. So
    :
    : Hangonaminute. If you're going to be pedantic, be correctly pedantic.
    :
    : The sovereign state is called "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and
    : Northern Ireland". Great Britain is the big island comprising most of
    : England, Wales and Scotland but excluding NI and all the small islands.
    : England, Scotland and Northern Ireland are countries. Wales is a
    : principality or a country depending on who you ask.
    :
    : > why are those folks from England, Scotland, Wales, & (Northern)
    : > Ireland, not "Ukers". The Scots, Catholic Northern-Irish, and Welch
    : > resent being called, or even though of as British, and they are
    : > supposed to be a "United Kingdom". What's up with that Bill?
    :
    : When I'm asked for my nationality, I usually put UK. But then I'm English.
    :
    : BTW the Welsh probably resent being called Welch. ;-)

    I'm told they would call you a Saxon.

    : > Why would you call citizens of The Netherlands, also known as Holland, "Dutch"?
    :
    : Holland is not the same thing as The Netherlands. The Netherlands is the
    : country. North and South Holland are just two of it's twelve provinces.
    : It's a very common mistake to make though.

    Sort of like inserting a spurious apostrophe into "its twelve provinces". :^)

    : As for why they're called Dutch - history. What do Germans call
    : themselves?

    Deutsch. And they call the Dutch "Hollandisch" (or so they told us when I
    studied German in college).

    The first verse of the German national anthem defines "Deutschland" so broadly
    as to include the Netherlands. After Adolph Hitler tried to make that a
    reality, those words were definitely unappreciated by the Dutch. So the
    Germans don't sing that verse anymore.

    : It's probably more correct to call someone from The
    : Netherlands a Netherlander.
    :
    : > Then the folks who come from Denmark are Danes, who speak Danish, ain't
    : > that great, and the danish you eat doesn't come from Denmark.
    : >
    : > Isn't it amazing what some of us "UnifiedStaters" can come up with? :)
    :
    : USians I thought. I struggle with what to call someone from the US.
    : American is far too wide. USian sounds a bit weird. US Citizen is a bit
    : official sounding.

    We call ourselves "Americans". (The notion that it's "far too wide" is a
    European fabrication.) Those south of us call us "norteamericanos". Depending
    on how far south of us they are, we call them "Mexicans", "Central Americans",
    or "South Americans". Nobody is particularly confused.

    Mexico's official name is "Estados Unidos Mexicanos" ("United Mexican
    States"). The similarity of their name to ours isn't a problem either.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 10, 2010
    #62
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  3. New Englanders!
    Nah. They're "Mainers".........
     
    John McWilliams, Dec 10, 2010
    #63
  4. Heh; reminds me of the definition of a "Yankee":

    o To a Brit, any American is a Yank
    o To Americans across the country, a Yankee is (was) someone from the
    North, as opposed to Southerners
    o To someone from the New England, a Yankee is someone from Vermont or
    Connecticut (as oppposed to anywhere else).

    I think there may even be one more level of specificity here, can't
    remember.


    --
    Comment on quaint Usenet customs, from Usenet:

    To me, the *plonk...* reminds me of the old man at the public hearing
    who stands to make his point, then removes his hearing aid as a sign
    that he is not going to hear any rebuttals.
     
    David Nebenzahl, Dec 10, 2010
    #64
  5. dickr2

    tony cooper Guest

    While what you say is not incorrect, North Carolians stretch that a
    bit. Back when people had money, many Floridians were buying second
    homes/vacation homes in North Carolina. When I was up there on
    vacation (not shopping for property), a local saw my Florida license
    plate and remarked to his friend "Another Yankee up here to buy
    property."
     
    tony cooper, Dec 10, 2010
    #65
  6. dickr2

    tony cooper Guest

    Prune the family tree.
     
    tony cooper, Dec 11, 2010
    #66
  7. We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
    'Septics'.
     
    Grimly Curmudgeon, Dec 11, 2010
    #67
  8. dickr2

    Eric Stevens Guest

    My experience is that the book from 1920 is more likely better.



    Eric Stevens
     
    Eric Stevens, Dec 11, 2010
    #68
  9. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    : Savageduck wrote:
    : > I guess it was a nod to the Spanish version of Phillip which is
    : > "Filipe". The archipelago was named for Phillip II of Spain.
    : > In Filipino/Tagalog the country is "Republika ng Pilipinas", no "h" &
    : > no "f".
    :
    : I'll buy that. I wonder if they have to lisp, too.

    My guess is that a (possibly aspirated) "p" is as close as Tagalog comes to
    having an "f" and that it has little or nothing to do with the p/f spelling
    debate. Another guess is that your biggest problem with the name of the
    country would be learning to pronounce "ng" without sounding like a rube.

    What you refer to as a lisp in Spanish is heard only in Spain. If you learn
    Spanish in the Western Hemisphere, you're unlikely to encounter it.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 11, 2010
    #69
  10. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    : Ollie Clark wrote:
    : > Savageduck wrote:
    : >>
    : >> Actually, that one is more confusing than you might think.
    : >> Technically the country, part of which lends its name to the language
    : >> "English", is The United Kingdom and is also known as Great Britain.
    : >> So
    : >
    : > Hangonaminute. If you're going to be pedantic, be correctly pedantic.
    : >
    : > The sovereign state is called "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and
    : > Northern Ireland". Great Britain is the big island comprising most of
    : > England, Wales and Scotland but excluding NI and all the small
    : > islands. England, Scotland and Northern Ireland are countries. Wales
    : > is a principality or a country depending on who you ask.
    : >
    : >> why are those folks from England, Scotland, Wales, & (Northern)
    : >> Ireland, not "Ukers". The Scots, Catholic Northern-Irish, and Welch
    : >> resent being called, or even though of as British, and they are
    : >> supposed to be a "United Kingdom". What's up with that Bill?
    : >
    : > When I'm asked for my nationality, I usually put UK. But then I'm
    : > English.
    : >
    : > BTW the Welsh probably resent being called Welch. ;-)
    : >
    : >> Why would you call citizens of The Netherlands, also known as
    : >> Holland, "Dutch"?
    : >
    : > Holland is not the same thing as The Netherlands. The Netherlands is
    : > the country. North and South Holland are just two of it's twelve
    : > provinces. It's a very common mistake to make though.
    : >
    : > As for why they're called Dutch - history. What do Germans call
    : > themselves? It's probably more correct to call someone from The
    : > Netherlands a Netherlander.
    : >
    : >> Then the folks who come from Denmark are Danes, who speak Danish,
    : >> ain't
    : >> that great, and the danish you eat doesn't come from Denmark.
    : >>
    : >> Isn't it amazing what some of us "UnifiedStaters" can come up with?
    : >> :)
    : >
    : > USians I thought. I struggle with what to call someone from the US.
    : > American is far too wide. USian sounds a bit weird. US Citizen is a
    : > bit official sounding.
    : >
    : > Cheers,
    : >
    : > Ollie
    :
    : I think "Yanks" is OK. But people are strange. I thought that calling Brits,
    : "Limeys" was OK, until somebody told me it was considered an insult. I said,
    : "Why? - They discovered that eating limes prevents scurvey, and that's where
    : the term comes from. It shouldn't be an insult, but a term of admiration.

    Whether "Limeys" is insulting or not, doesn't it refer only to sailors in the
    British Navy? I believe they were the only ones required to eat limes.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 11, 2010
    #70
  11. dickr2

    tony cooper Guest

    I did, and I know that there is such a thing. My description in the
    above shows that I did. I would add it to the list of things that
    there is really no purpose to owning and that take up drawer space.
     
    tony cooper, Dec 11, 2010
    #71
  12. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    On 10-12-09 17:36 , Robert Coe wrote:
    :
    : > 2) The quickest and surest way to destroy data on a CD or DVD is
    : > not to cut it up, but to scrape off the label.
    :
    : Unless you have a microwave handy.

    Which the guy in the police station being arrested for murder didn't.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 11, 2010
    #72
  13. Any high heat producing method, such as a fireplace, coal burning stove,
    boiler, would do nicely. Probably lighters and long matches.

    Dunno about oven, toaster oven, or such. Perhaps a strong blender or
    food processor would do the trick, too.

    Probably not big enough for Myth Busters.....
     
    John McWilliams, Dec 11, 2010
    #73
  14. Originally, maybe, but any more, "limey" is a generalized term for any
    Brit, and it is (mildly) offensive. Yet more evidence of Bill's
    overwhelming naivete that he doesn't get this at his age.

    Likewise, while "Yank" doesn't bother me, I can't imagine too many
    'Merkins would be thrilled to be called this by a limey ...


    --
    Comment on quaint Usenet customs, from Usenet:

    To me, the *plonk...* reminds me of the old man at the public hearing
    who stands to make his point, then removes his hearing aid as a sign
    that he is not going to hear any rebuttals.
     
    David Nebenzahl, Dec 11, 2010
    #74
  15. BTW, it's frequently "Bloody Yank", and effin' Limey.... just for the
    record...

    While neither "Yank" nor "Limey" is very derogatory, it does depend on
    how it's delivered.

    Once again, mileage varies.

    --
    john mcwilliams

    "I've won at every level, except college and pro."
    -Shaquille O'Neal, on his lack of championships.
    "I can't really remember the names of the clubs that we went to."
    -O'Neal on whether he had visited the Parthenon during his visit
    to Greece.
     
    John McWilliams, Dec 12, 2010
    #75
  16. dickr2

    Ollie Clark Guest

    You're almost right with where "limey" comes from. Whilst the Brits did
    apparently discover that eating citrus fruit helped prevent scurvy,
    they also knew (like everyone else) that lemons were better than limes.

    Problem was, they'd p***** off every lemon growing country in the world
    so all they had access to was limes from their colonies. Hence "limeys".

    So it was certainly an insult originally. I think you'd have to be pretty
    thin skinned to be offended by it these days. We've long since secured
    supplies of lemons.

    Cheers,

    Ollie
     
    Ollie Clark, Dec 13, 2010
    #76
  17. dickr2

    Eric Stevens Guest

    My experience is that the older books give you just the facts ("Just
    the facts ma'am") while the newer books spread things out over several
    pages with fancy diagrams and illustrations in an attempt to make
    things more 'interesting' to learn. All this garbage gets in the way.



    Eric Stevens
     
    Eric Stevens, Dec 13, 2010
    #77
  18. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    :
    : >: I think "Yanks" is OK. But people are strange. I thought that calling Brits,
    : >: "Limeys" was OK, until somebody told me it was considered an insult. I said,
    : >: "Why? - They discovered that eating limes prevents scurvey, and that's where
    : >: the term comes from. It shouldn't be an insult, but a term of admiration.
    : >
    : >Whether "Limeys" is insulting or not, doesn't it refer only to sailors in the
    : >British Navy? I believe they were the only ones required to eat limes.
    : >
    : >Bob
    :
    : To some in the US, "Yanks" only refers to northerners, and more
    : specifically, to New Englanders. Those south of the Mason-Dixon line
    : will very much object to being called "Yanks."

    Yeah, I know. I was born in Boston but grew up in Mississippi. In grade school
    other kids called me a "Yankee" (sometimes good-naturedly, sometimes not),
    even though I couldn't remember ever having lived in the north.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Jan 2, 2011
    #78
  19. Dayum, you must have one messed-up accent!


    N.B.: I found another reason not to use a cutesy non-standard quote
    delimiter (like your ":"): Thunderbird doesn't recognize it when you use
    the "rewrap" function ...


    --
    Comment on quaint Usenet customs, from Usenet>

    To me, the *plonk...* reminds me of the old man at the public hearing
    who stands to make his point, then removes his hearing aid as a sign
    that he is not going to hear any rebuttals.
     
    David Nebenzahl, Jan 2, 2011
    #79
  20. dickr2

    Robert Coe Guest

    : On 1/1/2011 7:34 PM Robert Coe spake thus:
    :
    : > On Sat, 01 Jan 2011 22:20:03 -0500, rwalker <>
    : > wrote:
    : >
    : >> On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 08:20:18 -0500, Robert Coe <>
    : >> wrote:
    : >>
    : >>>> I think "Yanks" is OK. But people are strange. I thought that
    : >>>> calling Brits, "Limeys" was OK, until somebody told me it was
    : >>>> considered an insult. I said, "Why? - They discovered that
    : >>>> eating limes prevents scurvey, and that's where the term comes
    : >>>> from. It shouldn't be an insult, but a term of admiration.
    : >>>
    : >>> Whether "Limeys" is insulting or not, doesn't it refer only to
    : >>> sailors in the British Navy? I believe they were the only ones
    : >>> required to eat limes.
    : >>>
    : >> To some in the US, "Yanks" only refers to northerners, and more
    : >> specifically, to New Englanders. Those south of the Mason-Dixon
    : >> line will very much object to being called "Yanks."
    : >
    : > Yeah, I know. I was born in Boston but grew up in Mississippi. In
    : > grade school other kids called me a "Yankee" (sometimes good-naturedly,
    : > sometimes not), even though I couldn't remember ever having lived in
    : > the north.
    :
    : Dayum, you must have one messed-up accent!

    I'm afraid so. Although I'm from the Boston area, as was my mother, both of my
    parents grew up in the midwest. So I learned to talk with basically an Ohio
    accent. I eventually picked up passable accents in the various places I've
    lived, but to a native I always sound like I'm from somewhere else.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Jan 2, 2011
    #80
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