Yellow Cast in Lightroom 5 Develop Window

Discussion in 'Digital Cameras' started by Greg Berchin, Apr 16, 2014.

  1. Greg Berchin

    Greg Berchin Guest

    I'm just learning how to use Lightroom 5. When converting from color to
    B&W, I find that the image preview in the Develop window has a
    pronounced yellow cast. I actually took a screen capture of the
    Lightroom preview and viewed it in PaintShop Pro -- found that a gray
    area of the previewed image that is actually 236:236:236 RGB is
    displayed in Lightroom as 254:232:189. What can I do to get Lightroom to
    display "gray" as "gray"? Thanks.
     
    Greg Berchin, Apr 16, 2014
    #1
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  2. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    When using the Lightroom 5 develop module to perform a simple (neutral
    or auto) conversion to B&W I see no such *yellow cast*.

    I am going to start with a few questions:
    1: Have you recently calibrated your display/monitor?
    2: Are you processing imported RAW files or JPEGs?
    3: Are you using LR5 presets, or the right side panel to make your conversions?
    4: If you are using the right side panel, are you using auto, or are
    you using the color sliders?

    Not all of the presets are going to give you a *pure grayscale*
    especially if there is some sort of toning effect applied.
    Also, when you first open the B&W panel all the sliders are neutral and
    will present a neutral B&W grayscale.
    Clicking the *Auto* button will make an image appropriate conversion
    which you can then tweak with the sliders.

    Here is a simple (neutral) grayscale LR5 B&W conversion with no
    evidence of a yellow cast.
    < https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_653.jpg >
    ....and the same after clicking on the Auto button.
    < https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_656.jpg >
    You can also make area adjustments by selecting the button on the top
    left of the B&W panel, placing the cursor where you want to tweak and
    *click+slide up or down*. This will move the sliders as if you were
    using filters with B&W film.
    < https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_657.jpg >

    I would add that I usually use NIK Silver Efex 2 to make my B&W
    conversions, but I have no issues using LR5 to make quick down & dirty
    B&W conversions.
     
    Savageduck, Apr 16, 2014
    #2
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  3. Greg Berchin

    Greg Berchin Guest

    I don't think that's the issue. As I mentioned, I can open the same
    monochrome image in Lightroom and in PaintShop. In Lightroom the image
    is displayed with a yellow cast. In PaintShop it is not. If I take a
    screen capture of the Lightroom display and view that in PaintShop, I
    can move the cursor over the image and have it display the actual pixel
    RGB values. The values displayed confirm the yellow cast that my eyes
    see.

    Unless ... is there something in a Preferences menu where Lightroom
    tries to do color compensation for some generic monitor? If so, then I
    need to change the compensation settings.
    They start as Canon .CR2 files. For the comparison in PaintShop above, I
    exported them as PSD.
    On the right side, I click "B&W". A set of sliders appears: Red, Orange,
    Yellow, etc. I do not change any of them.
    Auto seems to be applied automatically (no pun intended) when I click
    "B&W". The values that come up on the particular image that I am looking
    at right now are
    Red -11
    Orange -20
    Yellow -24
    Green -28
    Aqua -16
    Blue +14
    Purple +18
    Magenta +4
    That is what I am trying to eliminate -- any sort of toning effect. I
    want to see grayscale.
    Not in my version. See above. Even if I manually move all of the sliders
    to 0, the displayed image still has a strong yellow cast. Again, despite
    the yellow cast when displayed in Lightroom, if I export the image and
    open it in any other photo editor, the colors display correctly as
    shades of gray, and the pixel values verify that.

    Thanks,
    Greg
     
    Greg Berchin, Apr 16, 2014
    #3
  4. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    The only thing in preferences which might have some effect is the following:
    Open Preferences->Presets
    Default Develop Settings -> uncheck all.
    To clarify, are you importing the CR2s into LR5 unmolested &/or LR5
    converted to DNG, or after RAW processing in some other application?
    ....and that should be the result you get when neutral in the B&W panel.
    Hmmm..., not for me. Neutral first, then auto or adjusted.
    That is unusual behavior I have no other solution. Check those
    preferences, otherwise it might be time to contact Adobe support.
     
    Savageduck, Apr 16, 2014
    #4
  5. Greg Berchin

    Greg Berchin Guest

    Ah! That is where the B&W "auto" settings were set to be applied
    automatically.
    Importing directly. In general, I work directly with the .CR2 files in
    LR5, then save as (export) TIFF, PSD, or JPEG after modification. I do
    not ever change the actual .CR2 files.
    I looked through all of the preferences, found nothing that would
    explain the color cast. Thanks, I'll contact Adobe.

    Greg
     
    Greg Berchin, Apr 16, 2014
    #5
  6. Greg Berchin

    Greg Berchin Guest

    Found the answer in the Adobe Forum, here:
    http://forums.adobe.com/message/3160925#3160925. The color profile for
    the monitor must be set to sRGB. I had mine set to the manufacturer's
    default, and Lightroom was trying to compensate. Switched to sRGB and
    now gray is truly gray.

    Thanks for your help.
     
    Greg Berchin, Apr 17, 2014
    #6
  7. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    OK! To confirm, that is the monitor/display color profile. That makes
    sense in the above case where the inquirer is working on JPEGs in RGB.
    I would say that any odd monitor color profile could create a possible
    conflict. So on top of setting the correct monitor profile I would
    include recalibration.
    However, I use the recommended ProPhoto RGB for all my LR & PS RAW
    processing and only convert JPEGs to sRGB on export from LR5. (Not that
    my Mk.I eyeball could really tell the difference)

    I should add, I don't usually have any JPEGs in LR, only DNGs converted
    from NEF & CR2 RAW, Virtual copies, and TIFFs which have made a round
    trip to an external editor such as Photoshop or one of the NIK
    Collection plugins, and saved back to LR. All my editing is done
    nondestructively on those 16-bit DNGs, TIFFs, or virtual copies.
    My JPEGs are exported from LR using the LR export dialog, and are only
    created at that stage, including the switch from 16-bit to 8-bit and
    sRGB for online sharing.
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #7
  8. Greg Berchin

    Greg Berchin Guest

    Yes. It is set in the Windows Control Panel. I don't know how Macs
    handle it.
    As I mentioned, I am still learning to use Lightroom. At this point it
    looks like my workflow will be to convert CR2 to B&W in LR, export to
    PSD or TIFF, and then crop, resize, and convert to PNG or JPEG in an
    external editor.

    Wow. Seven acronyms in one sentence.
     
    Greg Berchin, Apr 17, 2014
    #8
  9. Greg Berchin

    Guest Guest

    it's in the displays system preference panel, which is essentially the
    same thing.
    do all of that in lightroom and then export the results in whatever
    size and format you want. there's no need for an external editor unless
    you are doing extensive and non-trivial retouching.

    the point of lightroom is to put everything you need in one app.

    and don't forget that lightroom is non-destructive, which means you can
    change the cropping at any time, as well as anything else you do.
     
    Guest, Apr 17, 2014
    #9
  10. Greg Berchin

    J. Clarke Guest

    I'm curious as to why you would use an external editor for this.
     
    J. Clarke, Apr 17, 2014
    #10
  11. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    Why crop, resize, and convert in an external editor when all of that
    can be done efficiently within LR?

    There is little which cannot be done in LR. I find that these days I
    only move to Photoshop from LR5 if I have compositing work, or content
    aware healing, cloning, patching or third party plugin work which
    cannot be achieved in LR alone. More and more my usual workflow is pure
    LR with fewer excursions into PS.

    If you are making the climb up that LR learning curve investing a bit
    of time with some of the online tutorials can give you a considerable
    leg up on that climb.

    Julieanne Kost has a lot to offer and is a good starting point for LR5
    < http://tv.adobe.com/show/getting-started-with-adobe-photoshop-lightroom-5/ >
    Then there is all she has to offer for LR
    < http://www.jkost.com/lightroom.html >

    ....and you cannot go far wrong getting a tip or two from Matt Kloskowski.
    < http://lightroomkillertips.com >
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #11
  12. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    Agreed.
    I suspect it is because Greg is new to LR and is unfamiliar with that workflow.
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #12
  13. Greg Berchin

    Greg Berchin Guest

    Bingo! I'm just not up to that lesson in the tutorials, yet.

    As far as I have been able to determine, LR only lets me export
    losslessly in PSD or TIFF. When I share photos, I like to use PNG. Is
    there a way to do that in LR?
     
    Greg Berchin, Apr 17, 2014
    #13
  14. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    LR will let you export losslesly in TIFF, PSD, or DNG. Unfortunately
    the only other LR export format options are JPEG or "original" no PNG.
    If I need a PNG, which is usually only when I need a transparency for
    some specific purpose or another I go to Photoshop.

    The resized JPEGs I get from LR present quite well online.
    < https://db.tt/NkRCiEUS >
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #14
  15. Greg Berchin

    Guest Guest

    in the lightroom export window (file menu), you can export jpg, png,
    tiff, dng or the original format, with the images renamed as needed
    (leaving the originals untouched), with a watermark and/or additional
    sharpening if desired.

    part of a non-destructive workflow is keep everything raw until the
    very end, where you decide what format and what size is needed, and
    then export it as appropriate.
     
    Guest, Apr 17, 2014
    #15
  16. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    Export as PNG is not an export option in LR5. If it is you need to
    explain just how to get there.
    Yup!
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #16
  17. Greg Berchin

    Guest Guest

    Export as PNG is not an export option in LR5. If it is you need to
    explain just how to get there.
    < https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_659.jpg >[/QUOTE]

    so it is. i even checked to see what formats export had before listing
    them, looking at that very same list.
     
    Guest, Apr 17, 2014
    #17
  18. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    so it is. i even checked to see what formats export had before listing
    them, looking at that very same list.[/QUOTE]

    Show me.
    I don't seem to have that option on the LR 5.4 the latest update on this Mac.
    ....and I have been using LR since the original beta.

    I suggest you look again. PNG does not exist in LR unless you import an
    original PNG. Then and only then can you export from LR as a PNG. (that
    would be the *original* option)
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #18
  19. Greg Berchin

    Guest Guest

    Show me.
    I don't seem to have that option on the LR 5.4 the latest update on this Mac.
    ...and I have been using LR since the original beta.

    I suggest you look again. PNG does not exist in LR unless you import an
    original PNG. Then and only then can you export from LR as a PNG. (that
    would be the *original* option)[/QUOTE]

    you misread what i wrote. i checked before i posted to list what was
    there, but somehow png snuck in. as you said (and your screenshot
    shows) it's not there.
     
    Guest, Apr 17, 2014
    #19
  20. Greg Berchin

    Savageduck Guest

    you misread what i wrote. i checked before i posted to list what was
    there, but somehow png snuck in. as you said (and your screenshot
    shows) it's not there.[/QUOTE]

    OK! Just trying to keep everything straight and unconfused.
     
    Savageduck, Apr 17, 2014
    #20
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